Let’s Talk About These Giancarlo Stanton Rumors

Giancarlo Stanton

The Giancarlo Stanton sweepstakes have been the most intriguing drama of the off-season thus far. The Miami Marlins have been sold to a new ownership group led by former Yankee Icon Derek Jeter. One of the new ownership group’s top priorities is to make the Marlins solvent again. The Fish have been awful for years and the new owners are looking to lower payroll. In order to do that they would have to jettison star slugger Giancarlo Stanton’s enormous contract.

Stanton is signed to a massive 13-year 325 million dollar deal with the option to opt out following the 2020 season. Stanton will be earning anywhere from 25-32 million dollars per season through the lifetime of the remainder of his contract. Trade proposals have been rolling in and of course the Dodgers are rumored to be one of the potential suitors.

Getting Stanton would be no easy task considering his gigantic contract, but he would be worth every penny. Stanton just recently won the National League MVP award after hitting 59 home runs and driving in 132 runs during the 2017 season. Stanton posted a .631 slugging percentage and scored 123 runs. He put up a 165 OPS+ and is one of the most valuable players in baseball.

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The Dodgers could theoretically put him in left field, despite him being a right fielder for his entire career. Stanton has played 942 games in right field and has never appeared in left field. He’s posted 49 defensive runs saved in his eight big league seasons. He’s a good outfielder too.

There are several other clubs that are rumored to be in on Stanton. The Red Sox, Phillies, Cardinals, and yes even the Giants (yuck) have been reportedly talking to the Marlins about possible trade scenarios. You can add the Dodgers in on those as well.

I wonder if the reports are accurate. Baseball executives are always exploring new trade opportunities to bolster their rosters every winter. That doesn’t necessarily mean that any of those reports come to life or are even close to coming true. You make the phone calls, you have discussions but sometimes that’s all they are. If the rumors of the Dodger’s involvement are even true. Even the beat reporters don’t know for sure what goes on behind closed doors of the Dodger’s front office.

Stanton has a full no-trade clause and has expressed interest in being moved to a contending club. The Dodgers won the pennant and tallied 104 wins during the regular season. There’s no better contender than the Dodgers to be traded too.

I hate to burst anyone’s bubble that’s hoping to see Stanton wearing Dodger Blue. I don’t see much of a chance of this happening.  The Dodgers don’t need many improvements to a roster that won 104 games and the National league pennant in 2017. There’s no question that Stanton would be a wonderful addition to the starting lineup, but it’s not like the Dodgers need him after slugging 221 home runs and scoring 770 runs in 2017.

It also would not fit into the narrative of the front office’s M.O. These guys are rarely known to make blockbuster trades that add huge amounts of payroll. Trading for Stanton would add hundreds of millions of dollars to the payroll putting the Dodgers at risk of penalties from the luxury tax. The Dodgers already have the most expensive payroll in baseball. Not that I would care, as I have said before. It’s not my money, nor is it yours. If the Dodgers want to increase payroll by a hundred million dollars to add Stanton or anyone close to him without losing top prospects than I would be all for it.

If the Dodgers were to acquire Stanton they would likely have to part ways with several top prospects, or take on a large amount of money. Those are both things that this current front office has stayed away from doing. Andrew Friedman and Farhan Zaidi love cheap young cost controlled players. Their philosophies have worked since the Dodgers were young, deep, multi-faceted and super efficient in 2017. Guess what, it worked. They won the pennant and came within a game from winning the World Series.

There is no question that Stanton would be an incredibly awesome acquisition. He’s one of the best players in baseball. He’s a home run hitting monster. He’s basically voltron with arms and legs. However it would cost a lot to get him and I don’t see the Dodger front office deviating from their usual blueprint. We’ll see how this whole thing plays out as the offseason progresses. Let’s just hope he doesn’t go to the Giants. Seriously.

Scott Andes

Scott Andes

Scott Andes: Former Co-editor of Lasorda’s Lair. Longtime writer and Dodger fanatic

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84 thoughts on “Let’s Talk About These Giancarlo Stanton Rumors

  1. that contract is idiotic for any club to take on, 13 years remaining with 25M annually. they must have some serious drugs in Miami for that deal to have been made. so five years of playing and then 8 years of just cashing checks, that math don’t work for me.

  2. Who really cares if he goes to the Giants?

    If he does, he will take up a massive portion of their payroll or a massive portion of their roster pool.

    Both are beneficial to maintaining the Dodgers competitive edge.

    1. Well, I’ll represent insanity.

      I want him. I don’t care about the contract and neither should anyone here. The Dodgers and MLB are rolling in it and that fact won’t change by adding Stanton. There are ways to do it and stay under the drop of pick level ($237mm) but who gives a rat’s ass if they go over it? They are already over the luxury tax cap. Payroll will be huge again. They don’t care and neither should we. And if the pick goes from 30 to 40 who cares? I’d give up that pick if it meant Stanton. Make it part of a PTBNL with Miami. You tell us who you want, we draft him and send him over a year later. Grandal, Pederson, a good arm not in the Top 10, 2 more players that will never make our roster and a first round pick. And you have to pay the last year on his contract or we pull Pederson. I don’t know. Details of that are not thought out. I’m high, maybe later.

      I don’t know him but think he would fit right in here. It’s possible the players do know him and don’t want him. If that’s the case don’t do it. But if the leaders say yes, make it happen. His presence in our lineup would be very cool.

  3. Well according to a story I read, the Giants made an offer. Not sure who. Me, I think he would make a dangerous lineup all that much more dangerous and his power from the right side balances the lineup. Adding him would automatically make the Dodgers the odds on favorite to go to and win the series. It would also make a few players totally available. Joc, Trace Thompson, Kike. Any or all could be moved. Money? Yeah, he would be expensive, but the guts of this team are all pretty young and there is money coming off the books at the end of 2018. Including possible the massive Kershaw contract. He is a So Cal boy, so automatically he is a home town hero. The farm system would not be gutted per se like if you were trying to pick him up for a post season run in July. And the one thing the Dodgers have that most of the teams bidding do not have…….Depth. A lot of it and most of the major talent in the Dodger system is at the lower levels. So they can mix and match prospects and a MLB ready player or two.

  4. If the FBZ is only worried about getting under the repeater tax penalty threshold ($237m) once every 3 years, then I think Stanton’s contract actually works out this year and for the next 3-4 years after that. But it will be a serious problem in the last 2-3 years.

    For this year, I think we can take on Stanton and also resign Morrow or Shaw if we trade Joc and Grandal. I think Urias and Santana may see September action and make the postseason roster, and they could surprise. If we need an innings eater I think there are some cheap veterans that are better than the Frias and Bolsinger flotsam we’ve used in years past, or Oaks. We will still need an impact arm at the trade deadline via trade. I think the FBZ stays away from big FA pitcher signings this year.

    In 2 years we could have a very good and very cheap infield: Ruiz/Farmer/W.Smith, Seager, Taylor, Barnes (at second) and Bellinger. This will allow us to absorb a ton of salary.

    That said, Stanton’s last 2-3 years is a real risk. Bryce Harper and Machado will also get long term contracts and also will have big risk there too on their last years. The risk added from Stanton is not more than the 2018 FA class, and in some ways less, and the deadweight years on Stanton potentially line up better than a similar 10+ year contract for Machado and Harper (and I don’t think we will go after Machado as Seager is the real deal and he will move to third after the Red Turn). So I do think FBZ has to think about this, and they could decide to pull the trigger.

    The dark horse is the Astros. The above analysis applies to them as well. They are essentially a carbon copy of the Dodgers except they are 1-2 more advanced in their process as they are not relying on rookies, but second and third year players. They have the room get Stanton too.

  5. FBZ thinks outside the box. Think a three way trade. Miami gets the minor leaguers (ours) Boston gets Stanton, and we get the cost controlled major leaguers (fromBoston and Miami) they sinfully covet.

    It’s ugly, but you’re right Scott it works.

    1. Artie, Stanton will NOT waive his no trade to go to Boston or St Louis. That has been stated more than once. Thinking a 3 way trade with Boston is workable is not realistic. He has full veto power and has stated more than once where he will not go.

    2. A 3 way involving California teams would probably work. Stanton is not likely to go to St. Louis and Boston – he negotiated that no trade clause for a reason.

      Maybe the Angels will help us. Stanton with Trout, with part of his salary paid … that could be the start of something for the Angels.

  6. While we are at Stanton, here’s another article on Ohtani. Basically it’s agreeing with my analysis from almost a week ago, that Ohtani is more of a difference maker in the NL than the AL.

    https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/is-ohtani-really-more-valuable-in-the-al/

    In fact, back to Stanton, I think his contract and his power plays best in the AL too. Which is why I worry about the Astros and, all things bring equal, would like him to end up an Angel – I think that’s best for him and it’d he worth the risk for the Angels as Stanton will sell tickets and can go do DH later. Angels can get some of our AAAA clutter which will be good for that franchise as they would be weighed down by 3 big contracts. Their pick of 3-4 guys out of the likes of Joc Pederson, Oaks, Segedin, Sopko, Font, and/or Kyle Farmer, would be godsends for the Angels. Miami can get salary relief and Grandal (who’s Cuban). We get Ozuna and clear clutter in our roster.

    1. In fact I think both Ohtani and Stanton wants to play for the Dodgers. That would be a huge coup for the FBZ if they can pull that off!!

      1. That might be enough for me to change my mind on these guys. Might be. I’m still waiting for them to put together the dynasty.

  7. From the fangraphs article YF posted:

    “Per Davenport, Ohtani’s 2016 numbers equate to the following MLB performance: 324 at-bats, 14 home runs, 34 walks, 89 strikeouts. The result? A .306/.367/.512 slash line.”

    Ok. Now run the same per Davenport calculations for Alex Guerrero’s Japanese stats and tell me what you come up with.

    1. Badger

      The Dodgers, and every major league team, is going after Ohtani, because he is a pitcher, and a pitcher who throws hundred.

      And anything Ohtani does with his bat, will be just another plus, and I don’t think you or anyone, would want to miss what Ohtani does with his bat, with the said power, he has.

      The curiously will probably always be there, with Ohtani.

      And I totally agree about Guerrero, just look what the Brewers got out of the guy, they got from the Korean league, and the Japanese league, is suppose to be even better!

  8. Right now, we are paying Kershaw 32 million a year, and he is not a full time player, like Stanton is.

    And the Marlins are going to have to pay for part of his contract, for the life of the contract, just like we have, with Kemp and Olivera, because the contact is way to long!

    If the front office makes a deal with Stanton, it is going to have to be a good deal for the Dodgers, so if they make this deal, I won’t worry about it.

    Because I like Stanton, and he will make a big difference in our line up, but I do worry about Stanton not being able to stay on the field..

    I will say this, only one or two of the players, on both the Dodgers and Astros, hit for good averages in this last World Series, and that is not surprising, since we are only talking about 7 games.

    And by the way, Corey had a better batting average then Altuve did.

    But Altuve hit one more HR then
    Corey did, and had one more RBI, then Corey had, but remember Corey was hurt.

    Cody did strike out way to much, but he had more key hits, then people remember, because I just saw a replay of one of the games in the World Series, and it showed one of Cody’s big hits, that I didn’t even remember about, until I saw it again, and I could think of three big hits Cody had, before I even saw the replay of this game, recently.

    Springer was the only Astro with a really good batting average, and Correa hit about 270, but other then these two players, the rest of the Astros players, didn’t hit for decent batting averages.

    And because of all of this, I still think we need a really good starting pitcher, even more.

    We can’t depend on Kershaw in the post season, so we need another top starting pitcher that can help Kershaw in the post season, and that is just the truth.

    Because pitchers make a much bigger difference, in these short series!

    And this should be apparent to any Dodger fan, after we have had to watch Bumgarner pitch the Giants to there World Series victories, and especially after we just saw what Verlander did for the Astros, in this entire post season, this year.

    And Package, Verlander only allowed three runs in both of the starts he made, in the World Series!

    And Kershaw gave up as many runs that Verlander gave up in two games, in one game, and that is why that is not acceptable for an ace pitcher, like Kershaw, is suppose to be!

    And in the next two years, there are not many good starting pitchers, that will be free agents, so it is important for the Dodgers, to find a way, to bring a top starting pitcher to the team, with so few starting pitchers, on the market.

    Because we don’t know how long it is going to take Buehler, to make a difference in our rotation, at the major league level.

    And Urias may never be the same pitcher again!

    Let’s just hope Ohtani talks to Darvish and Maeda, so the Dodgers get Ohtani!

    1. We haven’t paid Kershaw $32mm since ‘15. He makes $35,571,429. Contracts are measured with WAR not games or innings. He puts up 5 WAR he earns the dough.

      I don’t think Ohtani is going to step into a Major League batters box and slash the numbers posted earlier. That said, yeah, I want him. Star power. Lots of it. At every position. On the field, in the bullpen and in the dugout.

      1. Badger

        I googled what Kershaw made a year, and that was apparently what he made in 2016, not this year, like you said.

        But if everything is about war, at Fangraphs, they are estimating Kershaw’s war, at 4.6 this year, so by your war numbers, that is a over pay!

        But in LA, a players or a pitchers war numbers, are not the only thing that counts, because if the Dodgers don’t win the World Series, there season is not considered a success!

        Kershaw is only getting older, and the fact he has not been able to stay off the DL in the last couple years, does not help Kershaw’s case, and neither does his performance, in the World Series, and in the post season, in the last few years.

        And he is the highest paid player on the Dodger, so even more is expected from Kershaw.

        And the Dodgers not only came up short this year, but there highest paid player, also came up short, once again!

        That is why I think we need more pitching help, to get us over, especially after Darvish didn’t help.

        I don’t think anyone can really estimate what a player from the Japane league will do, but the only reason people won’t leave there seats when Ohtani is up, is his power, not an estimate of what his numbers will be in the US!

        I watching the Rams game, and those announcers, make me feel like I am watching the World Series again.

    2. MJ
      What is wrong with you? Why do you keep hating on Kershaw? OK, I will concede that Kershaw allowed 6 runs on 4 hits in game 5. That is it!! No loss in a 13 to 12 final. Blame him for that loss if you want but lets take a look at 6 of the 8 starters;
      Seager .222/.290/.370/.661
      Taylor .222/.344/.407/.751
      Barnes .174/.200/.217/.417
      Turner .160/.323/.360/.660
      Puig .148/.179/.370/.549
      Bellingr..143/.172/.393/.565

      Between the 6 of them, they struck out 45 times and who knows how many were with runners in scoring position. THEY ABSOLUTELY STUNK!!!! Everybody of this site knows that Cody is my boy but he stunk it up big time with 17 stikeouts. You cannot win games if you can’t hit and hit when it counts. You give everybody on the team a pass except Kershaw, a future HOFer. Shame on you! You need to learn that the World Series is 7 games, not a piece of one. I know some take your side but they are just as wrong as you are.

      1. Package

        Did you look at the Astro’s numbers in the World Series, they were not and much better?

        We are talking about only seven games, and you would never measure any hitter’s offense, just in seven games!

        The fact is Kershaw was first given 4 runs to work with, and he coughed up those four runs, in four innings, and then coughed up another three runs, in less then a inning, and gave the lead a way!

        I don’t think when a team scores six runs, they are not producing on offense!

        And you won’t find anyone that knows anything about baseball, that doesn’t think, a major leauge pitcher, should be able to hold up a six run lead, let alone, an ace major league pitcher, that is getting paid 35 million dollars a year!

        This team gave our pitcher’s runs to work with, and they did it as a team, like they did all year, and just like all year, it was a different player, that helped them win, and score runs, in this series!

        And that is why there are not but a couple of players, who have decent numbers.

        But this is far from the first time, Kershaw has let his team down, and coughed up a six run lead, the team gave him, to work with, in the post season!

        And you are ridiculous, by expecting more from a rookie player, and these other young players, then a veteran ace pitcher, like Kershaw!

        And if you really look at what the Astro’s hitters did in this series, like I did, you will find there numbers, are not much better, and that just might surprise you, like he did me!

        And the thing you don’t understand, there wouldn’t have been seven games, if Kershaw and Darvish, did there jobs!

        But the main point about Kershaw, is that this has been an ongoing problem with Kershaw, in the post season, and that is why the Dodgers have not won the World Series even once, during Kershaw’s reign!

        And if Kershaw’s post season numbers, were the only numbers the baseball hall of fame were looking at, to see if Kershaw belonged in the hall of fame, he would never make it!

    1. Badger

      You just might hold up better, but I am not against adding Stanton to the team, if they can get a decent deal.

      The Marlins will have to pay some money every year of that contract, to make it make sense for any team, to go after Stanton.

      Stanton would make everyone better in our line up, and he has always done well, in LA.

      I just think we need another good starter, because you are right, we must get two good starts at least, from our top pitchers, and Kenley has to do his job too.

  9. First will come the setting of the 40 man roster. Who gets non tendered? Font is probably a lock to be non tendered. They need roster space for Santana and Oaks if they want to protect them in the rule 5 draft. Do they just cut Trayce Thompson loose? Over their first years here these guys have done some trades at the winter meetings. Last year the priority was re-signing Turner, Hill and Jansen. Story the other day on Dodger Blue had Zaidi saying that they wanted to add an elite player. Do they make the big splash? We all have been waiting for them to make some kind of trade like that. They have a surplus of outfielders and a lot of talent in the lower levels of the farm system. Two moves I would make, and this is just me, would be to jettison any way I could both Kazmir and McCarthy. Sorry, I think they are two DL guys waiting to happen and I would just eat the money, or get that new batch of bats that you might get in a trade. I think the only free agent they are seriously thinking about bringing back would be Morrow. None of the others seem to be viable options. They sure as hell are not going to pony up the amount it is going to take to re-sign Darvish. Utley and Granderson are over the hill and gone. Watson could be re-signed, but not sure they want to since they are involved in talks with the Orioles about Britton. They have some trade chips that might be attractive to other teams. There have even been suggestions on some sites that they might be willing to trade Maeda, although that makes little sense with the rotation as left handed heavy as it is. The fun begins in 24 days.

  10. Jerry Dipoto of the Mariners just made his third third trade in the offseason – all small. Since 2015, when he was made GM of the Mariners, Dipoto has made the most trades in the MLB (46 trades). Dipoto worked under Byrnes in AZ, and as some may recall, as the Angels GM he butted against Mike Scioscia who was old school. Many teams are doing the churn, and some are churning as much as, or evne more than, the FBZ. All fans should do the churn dance at the ballpark, to the tune of the macarena when the game goes to the extra innings, that is when those churned AAAA ballplayers show up the most.

  11. Time moves slowly from November to March.

    I don’t mean to speak for MJ but I know what she’s talking about. I know what Package is talking about too. Kershaw didn’t take the loss in that 13-12 game. That honor went to Jansen. But what MJ said was “we can’t depend on Kershaw in the post season”, and the numbers bear that out. Kershaw has been to the post season 7 times. He has pitched in 24, started 19, and is 7-7 with a 4.35 ERA. You want to compare those numbers to Bumgarner? No, you don’t. Kershaw may be running out of time. What I see is a Dodger starting rotation that just isn’t strong enough to dominate in post season. I thought Darvish was a capable #2. I was wrong. The answer isn’t Hill, and apparently the Dodgers don’t believe it is Wood either. If it’s not going to be Kersahaw going 2-0, who is it going to be? The Dodgers look like they are trying to build a champion on the KC model, a dominant bullpen. Well, I don’t think modeling a team after the Royals is the way I would go.

    Hey, I’ll give credit where credit is due. They picked up Darvish, who was the second best RH starter available at the deadline.

    1. Badger
      I was only talking about the WS, not playing the Cards several years ago or some other team. MJ goes around the world spewing crap when we were talking about the WS. Kershaw did have a bad game in the WS but he also had a good one and a good relief appearance. MJ runs him down like he some sort of an opposition pitcher not a future DODGER HOF pitcher. I find that deplorable and inexcusable.

      1. Package

        Kershaw’s four innings of relief in game seven did one thing, it helped Kershaw lower his high era, in the World Series.

        Because that game seven, would have never been needed to be played, if Kershaw did his job, in his second start, instead of giving away a six run lead!

        Every Dodger fan wants Kershaw to be that same pitcher in the post season, that he is, in the regular season, including me!

        But he isn’t that same pitcher, and what you are not seeming to understand, is more is expected from Kershaw, then any player on this team, let alone a 21 year old rookie, who only played a month, in AAA, before he came up!

        Because Kershaw is the highest paid pitcher in baseball.

        And in baseball, especially in a short series, pitching is usually much more dominant, and that starts with your top two starters, before anyone else!

        1. MJ
          I cannot make you like or respect Kershaw and all he has meant to this team so I will just say that if you want to continue to blame, disrespect and just hate on him, be my guest. We will just agree to disagree.

          1. Package

            That is your problem, just because you hate certain players, or people, that doesn’t mean I do!

            And if Kershaw is going to opt out, and demand more money, every two years, he will always will be expected to do more.

            And it isn’t like Kershaw, has not been given enough chances, to show he can be that same pitcher, in the post season.

            And you ought to check out both Woods and Hill’s numbers, in the World Series, if you think I am being so hard on Kershaw!

          2. I don’t think MJ hates on Kershaw. She blames him, that’s all, and she hasn’t stopped (yet). I blame the FAZ (then) for not getting Verlander. It’s not going to end.

    2. Well Kershaw has not been dominant in the post season that is obvious. But he is 6-2 over the last 3 post season’s compared to 1-5 prior to that. In the 3 post seasons prior 2009-13-14, he was 1-5 with an ERA of over 5. The last 3 the ERA is around 3.7. In 2014 he was abysmal, 0-2 ERA over 7. 2013 his ERA was decent, but he lost 2 of the 3 games he pitched. In almost every post season he has had that one awful game that skewed his ERA. But he also made a couple of those bad starts on short rest and he has never been very good on those days. Kershaw to his credit has always taken the blame for those bad games. Who knows why he has that kind of record in the post season. But putting the onus on the guy as the reason for the teams failure is a little harsh. The offense this year in the World Series did not get the job done and the pitching did not contain the Astros hitters. Giving up 15 home runs in 7 games is pitiful to say the least. Teams win and lose together. This was a total team flop. Jansen was pedestrian, Roberts leaned on the BP too much. It might have worked against the Cubs and D-Backs, but it did not work against Houston. Plus the offense was shut down by some mediocre pitchers. Hitters did not adjust and kept swinging at balls they were never going to hit. Had they gotten just one good start out of Darvish, the outcome would have been different. Too much tinkering and not enough production.

      1. Mr. Norris
        Finally a voice of reason. I do think that if not for the tinkering that by itself would have been enough for the Dodgers to win the WS. We all know who did the tinkering.

          1. Well, all phases flunked a few tests. The rotation, the pen, the offense and the defense had moments. Then the tinkering, including a questionable deadline purchase. I think one could describe it as an organizational hairball. Of course I would never do that…….

          2. Yeah, I’m on the other side from Badger.

            A lovely, wonderful season where the team ended with the best record.

            A great playoff run, ending with a Game 7 loss to a very good team. A disappointing end to a glorious season for a team with a very rosy future.

      2. Michael

        Kershaw has also pitched badly in the post season, and on exta rest, and with three different catchers, catching him, and in only the seventh inning, this is obviously on Kershaw!

        And no one has not made Darvish responsible for his starts, here either!

        And when are you going to understand pitcher’s wins, don’t mean much!

        And that is because a pitcher can only win a game, if he gets run support, from his team!

        A good example of run support and how it affects whether a pitcher wins or not, is what happened to Verlander in this series!

        Even though Verlander didn’t give up more then three runs in his starts, he didn’t win a single game in this series, like Kershaw did.

        And Verlander out pitched Kershaw, in this series!

        1. Okay, Kershaw got the run support in his win and Verlander got none. So what? That’s because the other pitcher or pitchers shut you down. The Dodgers pitching shut down the Astros in game 1, not so much in games 2 and 5 when they had the lead. Kershaw’s meltdown came in game 5. But what you fail to realize if that this is a team sport. Unless a guy totally puts you behind the 8 ball, you win as a team and you lose as a team. There is as much onus on the starting 8 as there is on the starting pitcher. You believe wins mean nothing. I happen to disagree. Less attention is payed to that stat, that is obvious. But that by no means means that they are an unimportant stat. How else do you measure a pitchers worth? Badger suggested a players WAR. But closers are paid on saves, and wins are just as important as saves. To they place you according to team WAR and not wins? No, it is your won and lost record that dictates where you are in the standings. It has been thus in baseball since it was invented. So why should a baseball purist think any other way of judging a player thought up by some geek who never played a single inning in their life is a baseball absolute way of judging a player? Do you devalue what Cy Young did in the deadball era and reduce the impact of 511 wins? Babe’s 714 homers or the fact that Ty Cobb’s career batting average has never come close to being challenged. Is Kershaw a better pitcher than Koufax? His career ERA is one of the best in the last 100 years for a pitcher with as many starts as he has. The game has changed. People place expectations on players, especially when they make a lot of money. Kershaw matured pretty early. It took Koufax six years before he even had a decent season. Then over the last 5 seasons he was dominant. His post season stats are naturally limited to the World Series. 4-3 with an ERA of about 1.08. Those 6 years got him in the HOF with a career record of 165-87. He won 129 of those games over his last 6 years. Kershaw now sits at 144-65. He has won 20 games twice and has never had a losing season in the major leagues. That says a lot about the teams he has played for as it does his pitching. But CK gets way more run support than Koufax did. One time Drysdale was told that Koufax had pitched a no hitter, his reply was, did he win? That was back when the Dodger offense was pitiful. Had Koufax and Big D had the kind of run support the Dodgers now have, they could have won 30 games each. As for Darvish, I think I have seen a lot of criticism of him on here for his series el floppo. I also think a lot of people have put the onus on Roberts for leaving him in too long. Some would have pulled him after the first hit in the 2nd inning in game 7. Not that it would have mattered because the Astro’s pitching never waivered in that game. I get your point and your argument, I just happen to not agree with you. Oh, and Kershaw is allowed to pitch deeper in games than the other members of the staff because he has been the one most reliable at doing that……

    1. It is not about re-signing Kershaw. He has an opt-out clause for after the year. If he opts out, then they would need to make him a new contract offer. They have a lot of money coming off the books after next year, McCarthy, Kazmir, and Gonzalez will all be gone and close to 40 million in payroll with them. Trading for Stanton would impact this year unless they dump some salary. But the FO has never traded for a star of his stature since they have been here. Doubt they will do that now.

      1. I doubt it too Bear.

        Trading for him now obvious would add to payroll right away but how much depends on who goes that direction. I think it’s clear we don’t need Pederson and Grandal but that doesn’t mean they both go in that deal. However, to stay under the $237mm it would help if they were moved. As for Ozuna, yeah, he would be a nice RH addition, but obviously he ain’t Stanton.

        As for Kershaw, I look for him to be better than he has been the last two years. If he intends to opt out he better be. At 30, with two straight years on the DL, he won’t likely get a Greinke contract if he has a third straight year wounded.

        1. Badger
          Even if Kershaw stays healthy, it will be hard for him to generate the kind of numbers needed to demand a better contract because of Roberts. I think it is clear that Roberts will not allow any pitcher to pitch long enough to come back in certain games and get wins and other necessary stats. Not to mention no decisions and strikeouts. Kershaw needs to go 100 or more pitches every game. I don’t think the Dodgers will win 104 games either. Hope I am wrong.

          1. I agree with that Pack. I wouldn’t plan on 200 innings out of anybody on the Dodger staff. If he gets 175 again it would be a win and could land him an extension from somebody. I don’t know I would do it. He already makes more than twice what FAZ prefers to pay starters. I would not be surprised if they let him walk and use the saved money to buy another Hill or two.

          2. If he does have a good year, Houston or Texas may extend him. Depends on what he asks. With cost of WAR going to $10mm all he has to do to earn $35mm is 3.5 WAR. He could do that with 150 innings.

          3. You don’t need to average 7 innings anymore to justify a huge contract.

            I hope Kershaw says, screw the ERA and Whip and just pace himself for the postseason. This will also lead him to play out his contract.

        2. For him to pitch better he will have to pitch softer and allow catcher visits during an inning. If he pitches less fastball slider, more curves, the third and fourth time through the lineup he can be more effective.

        1. And for everyone’s information!

          The Dodgers scored 34 runs, in all 7 games, in the World Series!

          And the Astros also only scored 34 runs, in all seven games, in the World Series too!

          So much, for all the talk, about lack of run support!

          1. Gm 1 3-1 win, 2 7-6 loss, 3, 5-3 loss, 4, 6-2 win, 5, 13-12 loss, 6, 3-1 win, 7, 5-1 loss…….2 of the 4 losses at home. When you have home field, you should protect it, they did not.

        2. Hola Bluto.
          Que tal?
          Estoy bien, yo no intiendes.

          Then, Badger, can you translate it for me?

          >>>Will not can the Dodgers resign Kershaw if they go for Stanton,Or just resign Kershaw and make a trade for Osuna.

          I’ll take a stab:
          Can the Dodgers afford to resign Kershaw if they acquire Stanton? Or is it more affordable to resign Kershaw and make a trade for Osuna?

          Is that how you understood it?

          1. Michael

            That is the truth!

            I will leave the other, to
            Bluto!

            We lost two games in the World Series, after we scored 12 runs, and after we scored 6 runs, and that is plenty, of run support!

            And that happened, long before game seven!

            And we were not considered a better offensive team, then the Astros were, yet we scored as many runs, as the Astros did, in this series!

          2. Bluto….

            Yep.

            Let’s ask Norris.

            Hey Bear, did we get that right?

            I’ll say the Dodgers can afford Stanton AND Kershaw. I maintain it’s not about money, it’s about closing the deal.

          3. What does “closing the deal” mean?

            If it’s not about money, I’m sure we will hear a lot more scuttle about the Dodgers being interested. Like the Dozier talk from last off-season.

            If it’s about the money, I doubt we hear much.

  12. Okay Badger, here is my stab at it. First, if they are willing to not worry about the luxury tax, the Dodgers can afford anyone they want. Hell, they could trade for Stanton, if they have him they do not need Osuna, re-sign Darvish, or ignore him and go after someone like Cobb or Archer, They do need an upgrade in the rotation. Upgrade the bench, trade Grandal, Pederson, and Kike. Release McBrittle, Kazmir. Re-sign Morrow. Cut loose the older fringe guys like Segedin who have a minimal window for success. They may need a new 3rd base coach if Woodward is hired by the Yankees. Guys who have skills but have proven unreliable at times like Baez, Fields could also be traded. Non tender a couple of guys who are also non productive, say Font and Trayce Thompson unless you feel you can get some value in return. Yimi Garcia will be returning after almost 2 years on the DL. Gonzo is going to play winter ball in Mexico, so you should find out before spring if he will be healthy at all. You guys nailed the translation. There is also enough depth in the farm that you could trade guys who have more value, say Stripling or Stewart in a package deal for a front line starter without really damaging your pitching depth. Here is the snag. This FO has never really made a deal like that .

  13. Lets have a little fun….2018 HOF ballot. Players eligible. Who Gets in of these guys…..Bonds, Carpenter, Clemens, Damon, V. Guererro, L. Hernandez, Hoffman, Hudson, Huff, Isringhausen, A. Jones, C. Jones, Kent, Lee, Lidge, E. Martinez, McGriff, Matsui, Millwood, Moyer, Mussina, M. Ramirez, Rolen, Santana, Schilling, Sheffield, Sosa, Thome, Vizquel, Wagner, Walker, Wood, Zambrano. Tough choices huh? My picks would be, C. Jones, Jim Thome, and Hoffman with Vizquel and E. Martinez very close. This is Martinez last year on the ballot. As time goes by, Bonds and Clemens will garner more votes as less qualified players are eligible. Manny, Sheffield and Sosa will get some love, how much remains to be seen since all were linked in some way to PEDS.

        1. Thome, Hoffman and Jones. Guerrero might be close. Martinez with 18 years and a .933 career OPS would get strong consideration, but his defense really sucked.

    1. Chipper Jones, Thome and Vizquel. I don’t mind letting Bonds and Clemens into HoF but if it’s up to me I’d have them wait until the last year.

  14. Why can’t we have all three?

    Stanton, Ohtani, and resign Kershaw!

    When it comes to Ohtani, it sounds like he will decide which team he goes to, it isn’t about the money, at this point, in his major league career, or he would have waited, another two years, to get more money!

    Stanton wants to come to the Dodgers, and the Marlins want to move Stanton, and his big contract!

    And I don’t think Kershaw will want to pitch, in either of those two hitter’s park, in Texas!

    And I just don’t think Greinke realized how hard it really is, to pitch in a hitter’s park, most of the time, and especially compared, to Dodger Stadium.

    Because I think Greinke wore down at the end of the year, from the stress of pitching, in that hitter’s park, in Arizona.

    1. Darvish still wants to come back to the Dodgers, and I think Darvish is willing to give the Dodgers, a good deal.

      And signing Darvish, not only gives us another good arm, it may bring Ohtani to the Dodgers.

      And like I said, Ohtani won’t cost that much at this point, in his major league career.

      And I am sure, Ohtani would love to be on a team, with two of his countrymen, especially in his first season, in America baseball.

      1. Everyone is talking about Ohtani, BUT, the MLBPA and the Japanese league have to reach some sort of agreement on the posting process. It was reported that they had, but they have not. MLBPA’s biggest gripe is the posting price which was 20 million. Right now he is not free to come to the major leagues, when that changes is anyone’s guess. I do have one question MJ, what would be a good deal? He is going to want at least 5 years, and at least 20 million a year or more. Do the Dodgers dare commit that much to him? Also do you expect him to build on what he did with Honeycutt last year? So far the longest term contract to a pitcher this front office has issued is the 4 year deal they made with McCarthy.

        1. Michael

          Good question, you probably have a better idea about that, then I do!

          Would Darvish be comparable to Cueto?

          I thought Ohtanis’ team, had already gave him the ok to come over here, but I guess everyone will find out sometime in December.

          1. Well Cueto boosted his value with his playoff performance with the Royals. He also was 2 years younger than Darvish is now, had a much better career record at that point, 96-70, Darvish is 56-42 and 2 years older. Their career WHIPs are amazingly close Darvish 1.18 and Cueto 1.19. ERA’s are pretty similar too, Cueto 3.33 and Darvish 3.42. Question is how long a contract do you want to give to a pitcher who is 31? Dodgers might go 4 years with a buyout or option, McCarthy has an option on his deal, but I doubt they would go a full five like they offered Greinke. Difference is that Greinke was a former Cy Young winner. Cueto has had a pretty consistent career only having losing seasons twice. In his 5 full big league seasons, Darvish only had a losing record last year. I would go 4 years with an option and throw some incentives in there. But no more than that, Maybe start at 16 million a year. His post season stats are bad. But with the right coach who knows. As for Ohtani, and you can read this story yourself on MLB.com, they have until 8 PM Tuesday to reach a new agreement.

  15. Kershaw being on the DL two straight years mean trade him now ,I don’t think loyalty play’s a part with this front office.

    1. They are not going to trade Kershaw. Two reasons, best pitcher on the team in spite of being on the DL, he was 18-4 and 2, he is the face of the franchise.

          1. That is the good thing about Kershaw’s second start.

            I don’t think Kershaw wants to pitch on a regular bases, in Houston or at the Ranger’s hitter’s park.

          2. Kershaw wants to win and make a sh*tload of money. Other pitchers have done well in both Texas cities. Don’t know about winning with the Rangers, but he would do just fine in Houston.

  16. Badger

    Kershaw was given six runs to finally win it all, but this was on him, and he knows it!

    It wasn’t like his team let him down?

    And both teams, scored the exact same amount of runs.

    1. It was game 5 and they were tied 2 games apiece, so Kersh could not win it all. It was a bad game all around. Kersh could not have won because he left after 4 2/3. My take is that this season I do not let Kershaw pitch past the 7th inning no matter how well he is pitching unless he is throwing a no hitter, then I let him slide a little.

      1. Mostly agree. Number of innings depends on a few things. If he’s cruising and can complete a game on 100 pitches I’d let him finish. With today’s pitchers I think 90 is the new 115. Is it because they throw harder but not smarter? Maybe. Not sure about that. I’ll be looking for articles on what the strategy is for starters. Throw at 85% velocity with more spin? Change speeds and locate? Balls out full velocity for as long as you can? Guys like Maddux and Hershiser used grips to spin the ball 4 different directions and could hit any spot on the margins of the strike zone at will. I heard Orel talking about that once. I don’t know anybody that’s doing that now. Kershaw throws hard with what looks like a lot of torque on his back. I admit I am concerned about him going forward. He could be becoming a 27 start 5 inning pitcher. That might work as Rich Hill got 3.8 WAR with 110 innings in ‘16.

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