The Dodgers had already offered reliever Yimi Garcia a one-year contract on Friday avoiding arbitration with the right handed hurler. The Dodgers also tendered contracts to all 8 of their arbitration eligible players as well. The eight players all received contracts for the 2018 season from the club. These 8 players could still go to salary arbitration if they are unable to come to an agreement with Dodger management, but that’s normally unlikely.
The following 8 players are as listed: Catcher Yasmani Grandal, Outfielder Joc Pederson, Infielder/Outfielder Enrique Hernandez, and pitchers Alex Wood, Josh Fields, Luis Avilan, Tony Cingrani, and Pedro Baez.
In other news, the Dodgers are among the seven finalists in the Shohei Ohtani Negotiations. The Japanese superstar will meet with seven clubs with the Dodgers being one of them. The other teams involved are the Angels, Rangers, Padres, Mariners, Cubs and yes the Giants.
Shohei Ohtani is considering only these teams: Dodgers, Angels, Padres, Giants, Mariners, Rangers and Cubs. There are NO other teams that are still in it according to sources.
— Jim Bowden⚾️🏈 (@JimBowdenGM) December 4, 2017
Apparently reports indicate that Ohtani could have a preference for a west coast club that can give him proximity to his home country of Japan. The Ohtani and Giancarlo Stanton sagas have been unfolding over the last several weeks and many people believe has been preventing the hot stove from starting. Movement has been unusually slow with almost no significant trades or free agent signings happening since the offseason began after the Dodgers lost game 7 of the World Series. Reports are speculating that Ohtani could sign with a team by next week before the Winter Meetings kick-off.
What non pitching position(s) does Ohtani play?
He’s an outfielder Artie
Rangers sign Mike Minor. One of the Dodgers options is gone….
The FBZ is going to sit on their hands and negotiate with the leftovers.
I totally agree. Some chips are already falling. Most of them decent players on minor league deals including Derek Norris.
YF
That is FBZs normal way of doing business. I think Yu might have been the only really exceptional talent they have ever signed other than players who were already Dodgers resigning. Stanton is just a pipe dream I think.
I have to agree with you. I think Ohtani will go somewhere else too. Darvish was a rental and cost them 3 prospects. Money wise he was cheap, and that is why the FO traded for him rather than Verlander and his remaining contract. FBZ is more into unloading money than taking it on. No pitcher, save Jansen, has received a deal for more than 48 million dollars and only 1 of those was for 4 years, McCarthy. They gave the 37 year old Hill a 48 million dollar deal for 3 years. To my mind there is no way these guys resign Darvish, who is going to command a contract near 150 million dollars over 5 years. Right now the buzz is that Darvish is getting heavy interest from the Mariners. Dodgers big moves so far, signing 3 slugs to minor league deals, giving Garcia 660 thousand, tendering contracts to their 8 arbitration eligible players, and that is it. The Rangers got Minor, the Cardinals signed a former major leaguer who has been pitching in Japan, and doing pretty well over there, and the Angels signed the top player who was in Atlanta’s system and lost when they were hammered by MLB for their violations of the foreign player signing rules, Maitan, a SS. Typical FBZ, uh, hey guys, lets check the bone pile for scraps and see if we can find a low risk high reward piece.
Agree, don’t see any major moves this off-season.
I think the goal is to cut payroll, not build it.
Tolesy!
https://dodgers.mlblogs.com/watch-toles-working-his-way-back-dfc63d6b8ce9?gi=18072ad32abd
Thanks Bluto!
I just hope our guys don’t have that post season hangover some teams have, after they play deep into the post season.
The goal should be to win a championship. If it means losing $10 million in payroll then adding $25 million, I think they should do it if they believe it will accomplish that goal.
Interesting.
I could be wrong, but I think the team’s goal as much as to win a championship is to enjoy and realize sustained success.
Can both co-exist?
I think they can, but I also think that spending a little more cash on more reliable pitchers would enhance their chances. Of course that is not and has not been the FO of this particular bunch. There just are not that many trot them out there and get a solid 6 inning start pitchers anymore. If you look at things from the FO’s perspective, 5 straight division titles is pretty impressive. I remember the Braves winning title after title in the 90’s, but only 1 World Series. As it is much harder to make that goal now than ever, it can be looked on as a very successful stretch. Yes, we fans look on those as disappointing because the team did not win the big prize. The Dodgers are 473-337 over the last 5 years. That’s a lot of wins. I do not remember a stretch like this in LA Dodger history. Oh, they were good in the Lasorda years and when Walt managed, but there would almost always be a down year in a 5 year stretch. Actually I checked and they won 472 games between 62 and 1966. But two of those years they did not win the pennant. The were 2nd in 1962, mainly because they lost the playoffs to the Giants and finished 6th in 1964 with an 80-82 record. Koufax was out for almost the entire 2nd half with a circulation problem in his finger. So even though they almost won as many games as this bunch, they were winners because they made the World Series 3 times. They won two World Series, 1963, and 1965 while getting swept in the 66 tilt with the O’s. The biggest difference is the pitching staffs in those 5 years were a lot better than the one they have now. I would hope they would change it up just a little and make one of those really good baseball trades, but I do not see that happening.
Interesting article on Hardball Times. One caution – the data is manipulated to fit an agenda. But I agree with the agenda.
https://www.fangraphs.com/tht/evaluating-talent-distribution-on-rosters/
What’s the agenda? The agenda is “let’s all hail and kowtow to depth!” (But then they establish a category called Scrubs to eliminate the not so good “depth”. And they don’t normalize the data to payroll.)
Payroll estimates for 2018 sit around $214.5mm. I’ve been hearing for 3 years now from certain…. sources …… that each year the Dodgers were going to reset the cap in THIS year. Well, of course it did not happen and it won’t happen next year either. I suppose there is the possibility it can be achieved in ‘19 if they really want to, but I very much doubt it matters to them. MLB is swimming in money and the Dodgers are at the deep end of the pool. It would appear they are attempting to be smarter, purchasing spin rate over star power, but a 7 WAR MVP who wants to play in LA is difficult to ignore. Harper won’t want to play here. Not like Stanton does anyway. Machado might. He’s a Florida guy and nobody wants to play there. That might change soon, who knows. But a lineup anchored by Seager, Bellinger and Stanton for 5 years would draw crowds. Yeah, I hope it happens. He doesn’t have the same Chevy curb appeal (and spin rate) that McCarthy and Hill have, but he has Maserati sex appeal and he drives it carrying a 7 WAR Domenico Vacca diddy bag in the front seat. This may not draw interest from the FAZonian element, but he’s the fan’s choice.
Badger
I would hope if they are offered a good deal for Stanton by today’s standards in baseball, that they would sign him.
Because you are right, last year there were a lot of people who said they would never sign Kenley and Turner, because of the luxury tax, and they not only signed those guys, they signed Hill.
I don’t think one year left of the Luxary tax, will stop them from making a good deal, that would strengthen the Dodgers, especially since so much money comes off the Dodger’s payroll, the very next year!
And they are smart enough to get around one year, and if they did have to pay the luxury tax this year like they have, in the previous years, it is only for one year.
I do think Stanton would be a very big draw!
Because most of the men I have watched, and talked to, Love a player that can’t hit a ball as far as Stanton does, and the fact he is a home town guy, makes him a even bigger draw.
And there is probably only one other player in baseball, that hits a ball as far as Stanton does, so he is a very special player.
We have missed a big right hand hitter in our line up, ever since Hanley was let go, and Kemp was traded.
But unlike both Hanley and Kemp, Stanton is not a liability on defense, and even more importantly, Stanton is a team player, and the front office values that a lot too..
I do think we need a top starting pitcher more then anything, but it isn’t like we get a chance to get a player like Stanton, everyday.
And this front office was never going to try to sign Machado, or Harper anyways, so we won’t be missing out, on those two big free agents.
Stanton’s contract will probably look better, after those two players become free agents, because teams will be bidding against each other, and that will drive the price up on those two players.
I still hope we get Ohtani, because not only do we badly need another top starting pitcher, he is not going to cost that much, so not only he will be a steal, he might just be the ultimate heist!
I just don’t see Kershaw getting that much more money, then he is getting now, because he will be thirty next year, and he has had injury issues, in the last couple years, that has kept him, from making his starts.
This year was the first year, that Kershaw didn’t earn his money, by the standards in baseball, today.
MJ
Since you are an expert in how much players are worth and you think Kershaw did not earn his money in 2017. How much did he miss earning his money? 2 wins, 4 wins, more SOs? WHAT? I don’t know why you observe these things? I think it is hate that he has not acheived what you think he should and all the while you forget the regular season. Do you think Greinke and Scherzer earned their money? I wish you would give Kershaw a break. Or is it me you want to aggravate?
Relax Package, that is her opinion because she does not believe wins mean anything. Kershaw won 18 games, led the league and he missed 5 weeks! He earned his money. He was the ace hands down. Look at it this way, he won almost 17 percent of the Dodger wins all by himself. He won more games than Scherzer.
Michael
You have no idea how I am valuing Kershaw, so don’t speak for me!
And in baseball today, pitcher’s wins, are not valued that much!
And because of that, front office don’t value pitchers, in that way!
I was just quoting your argument that pitchers wins do not mean all that much because pitchers wins are dependent on run support. We have argued this for months. You believe what you like. Kershaw more than earned his money last year, where as McBrittle, and Kazmir did not. And I have never spoken to you, I have just replied to your posts. You do not like what I post, then do not reply. I have as much right to my opinion as you do. The FO may not value pitchers wins, but I do. And that is the way they have been valued for over 100 years. You and the FO’s are the ones who are attempting to change history not me, so come down off your damn high horse. You are not always right
Mr. Norris
Thanks for the thoughful comment. I guess I am just short on patience with DUMB. I always have been. On the job it was never acceptable and it cost many their jobs. Koufax and Kershaw are always my favorites. Stupid comments are hard to stomach.
A few years ago I read, and posted, an article at fangraphs called “the Cost of WAR”. Basically it reported that a players value is based on an algorithm called Wins Above Replacement and what it is what GMs can expect to pay in the coming years for those free agents who put up superior WAR numbers. Using that concept as a basis, 2017 Cost of WAR was in the neighborhood of $7.5 mm per WAR point. Kershaw put up 4.6 rWAR, and 4.6 fWAR. You can do the math, but by that criteria Kershaw did not earn his $35.5mm. It’s not necessarily what I think, it’s just numbers.
I did read somewhere that the Cost of WAR is going up to $8mm per point next year. It’s important to note, this applies only to those players who have already qualified as “free agent”, meaning they are no longer bound by arbitration. What successful teams, including the Dodgers, are doing now is of course getting outstanding WAR numbers out of younger team controlled players and sprinkling in established stars at key positions on the 25 man.
The Dodgers are dropping millions from payroll as players like Ethier and Crawford fall away. They can afford to do whatever they want. They have a Division winner favorite as is. If they want to add a free agent starter and a couple bullpen pieces? Easy peasy. They can do that without dumping any payroll. If they want Stanton, $25mm, they can do that without going over the $237mm. If they want all 3, starter, pen, Stanton, they may have to move Grandal and Pederson. If they want to make trades for the needs, clearly they can do that too.
What do they want? We still don’t know, but whatever it is they can do it.
They are still paying Kemp like 5.5 mil a year. Gonzo’s 23 million comes off the book next year. Gonzo has a full no-trade which pretty much means he is not going to be traded. And I read an article the other day that said he aims to reclaim his starting job if he is healthy enough to do so. FBZ could do a little creative trading and find a way to accommodate Stanton very easily. They have tons of top prospects that will probably never see a day at the major league level, so they could easily form a package that would be better than what St Louis or the Gints have put together.
Thanks Badger!
That is what I was talking about.
And I am sure that will be brought up in the negotiations, after Kershaw opts out.
They will also bring up his age, and his injury history too.
And Package anytime we talk about the payroll, we also have to address Kershaw opting out, after the 2018 season.
yada yada yada, same old BS argument You do not base next years payroll on Kersh opting out UNTIL HE ACTUALLY DOES SO.
Michael
Every front office has to think ahead, before they make a move, and especially for a team like the Dodgers, that have had to pay a luxary penalty, the last few years!
And that is just a fact, and that is why all you can say, is yada, yada, yada!
Michael
I didn’t say you, talked to me!
I said, don’t talk for me!
Because you tried to talk for me, when you told Package, the way, I was valuing Kershaw.
And you were wrong, because I was not valuing Kershaw, in that way, you said I was!
And I don’t even know why you are bringing McCarthy and Kazmir, into this discussion, because no one here, ever thought those two signings were good, including me!
And you comparing those two pitchers, to Kershaw, makes your argument, look even weaker!
Because McCarthy and Kazmir, are not in the same class, as Kershaw is, and it isn’t even close!
Also when you compared Scherzer to Kershaw, and tried to make your point about a pitcher’s wins, you made my point!
If pitchers wins were valued so much in baseball today, why did Scherzer win the CY Young award, when Kershaw had two more wins?
And when you said Kershaw was responsible for 17 percent of the Dodgers wins, this year, that is just not true.
Because Kershaw had to have enough run support, from his team, to win every one of those games, so those were team wins!
And any pitcher is dependent on run support, from there team, to win any game!
And that has been the truth in baseball, for over hundred years, even if you can’t see it!
Oh shut up…..same old tired thing you always say. I care less about your opinion because you are a dingbat. The pitchers cannot win without run support and the hitters cannot win unless the pitcher does his damn job. You can say that about every pitcher in history, and the only reason I brought up Kazmir and McBrittle was because they did not do their job. Kershaw did. Scherzer won because more people voted for him as the # 1 pitcher, that is the only reason. He got more first place votes. Who cares? You use the same old lame ass argument all the time. I care less about how todays FO’s value their pitchers. All their saber metric crap means nothing to me. Neither does your constant dribble about Kershaw, and fool with eyes can tell he is a good pitcher, one of the best there is, but for you that is not enough. He needs to win every game in every post season series to even be considered as good. The numbers speak for them selves. Do not try and tell me or anyone else what to think. It is a TEAM game MORON. It takes every damn player on the field doing their job to win. NO ONE PERSON can win a game on their own.
Kershaw opting out has nothing to do with whether or not he is earning his money.
Package
Kershaw opting out, is all about money.
And You better believe, Kershaw’s agent, is going to ask for more money!
And the front office will make there case to, and Kershaw’s War along with his age, and injury history, will all come into play!
And your ar crazy, if you don’t think this is about earning, or not earning, money!
MJ
You said “This was the first year, that Kershaw did not earn his money, by the standards in baseball today”. My question was how are you figuring that he did not earn his money and how much is he short of earning his money? MY QUESTION WAS NOT WHETHER OPTING OUT WAS ABOUT MONEY BUT RATHER IF KERSHAW EARNED HIS MONEY!!!!!!! Can you read?? You are sharp as a marble.
Ignore her. She says the same crap over and over. Pitchers need run support so their wins mean nothing. Kershaw is the best pitcher the Dodgers have period and she is just jaded and in her own baseball world and has no clue what the hell she is talking about…
Badger,
Why should WAR be the all in device to use to determine what a player is worth? That is nothing more than a subjective figure developed by a bunch of Geeks and I really have reservations as to how much it is worth. Some sabermetrics are of value while others mean nothing of value. Just an opinion.
Well Pack, I’m not the one that determines the science of meter. That’s what the new wave baseball nerds do.
https://www.fangraphs.com/library/misc/war/
It’s just how it is now. A lot of math goes into figuring player worth, and I’m told it’s an evolving science, but I’m pretty sure it’s here to stay. I’m getting used to it.
MJ
Just forget answering my last comment to you. You are not smart enough to handle it. Also, if no one has ever spoken to you like that. Today’s the day.
Package
I don’t value your opinion, so I am not hurt, by your name calling!
And when a person calls people names, that says more about the person, that is calling someone a name, then the person they are trying to put down!
I already told you, how I valued if Kershaw earned his money last year, by baseball standards, today!
And Badger told you too!
And I am not giving you anymore energy about this, because that is what you want!
And I have already put to much energy, into this ridiculous conversation!
Using WAR to Value Players:
https://saberballblog.com/war-player-evaluation/
Can we please be civil to each other? This is sounding like the days before he who shall not be named left.
Good Morning Everyone
Any news on the Ohtani, Stanton fronts? I have not heard anything new yet. Meanwhile does it sound like the Dodgers may keep Brandon Morrow? I like him but don’t think he will sign a multiyear contract with the Dodgers.
Michael
This is nothing I am making up on my own!
Pitchers wins don’t mean as much in baseball today!
And if a pitcher’s wins meant so much, how come a reliever can come into a game, and not pitch especially well, and can still get a win, if his team takes the lead, the next time they are up to bat?
And it is a fact that a pitcher can’t pick up a win without run support, so I am quoting a fact, not making an argument!
Also the way I valued Kershaw, was not something I made up on my own either!
I was just following the way they value players in baseball today!
I didn’t make this valuing system up, and I was just following how they value players, in baseball today!
Maybe some better educate themselves, and learn some about modern baseball, before they criticize me for using something that they use, in baseball today!
I thought it was good that Kershaw didn’t have a big case, to ask for to more money.
Because maybe that will keep Kershaw from asking for much more money, along with his injury issues, so the Dodgers could add a player like Stanton!
Kershaw is the highest paid player on the Dodgers, and he is going to opt out, after the 2018 season, so his money has to be figured into the future money the Dodgers spend!
And every players worth goes down in baseball, after they are out of there prime years, and Kershaw is already out of his prime years, he will be thirty next year.
Also Kershaw’s injury issues, come into play too, and especially after he has had to go out on the DL two years in a row!
No news yet, but it’s coming.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/howardcole/2017/12/06/giancarlos-stanton-contract-is-not-the-obstacle-for-dodgers-its-been-made-out-to-be/#743ca292464a
Another theory on obtaining Stanton for your consideration.
Good find!
Interesting read, but I have serious doubts about Miami taking out our trash for us. Still, I like the though process.
The issue isn’t Stanton price or value for this year, it’s for the future years. Ryan Howard is a fear.
What did you think of that article Package?
I found it decently written and poorly reasoned.
I think the article makes a lot of sense if you already want Stanton but not so much if you don’t really care if they get him or not. Me, I want him. I like excitement and he delivers on that front. I am tired of the vanilla FBZ, I want them to dominate every year whatever it takes. What I think we have found is the FO has found another way to win with their constant lineup changes, use of the 10 DL, and scraping the injured scrap heap, and other things. Their way they proved works but the cost is not really being excited much. They get hohum wins . They do not get HRs over the Pavillon or huge bunches of runs. I don’t see them as dominant but good enough to get wins and last year they had a whole lot of luck. Just an opinion. You can’t argue with success.
Can’t argue with success.
I thought the article made a lot of sense too. I understand the Howard reference, but I think Stanton is a better athlete and sure as hell has put up better numbers by age 27 than Howard did. I can see Stanton being productive for the length of his contract. He may finish as a DH or a first baseman, but I see no reason he can’t play to age 37.
Badger
I am trying but it is not working out very well.
Mr. Norris
Remember Wally Moon? I wonder if he used the bat angle theory to it fly balls that is used today? Or maybe a version?
Old friend Dee Gordon sent to the Seattle Ms where he is reported to play CF. It has not been announced who the Marlins will receive in return.
Badger
I think we should get Stanton while we have a chance, because I think his contract will look a lot better, after we see what Harper and Machado get.
Stanton is two years older, but we have been missing a good right hand bat, since Hanley was let go, and Kemp was traded.
And Stanton is no liability on defense and he is a team player.
We can’t let the Giants get him.
Rumors have the Mariners and Padres as favorites to land Ohtani.
The Marlins also gave up a million in pool money to get rid of Dee Gordon’s contract.
The prospects haul for the Marlins … not impressed or intrigued. More interesting is that the Mariners will try to convert Dee Gordon into a CF.
His contract looks pretty easy to me. He just put up 3.1 WAR for $7.8mm and doesn’t make more than $14 million through age 33. I think it’s safe to say he will earn his money to the end of the deal. The Marlins just dumped a guy who had over 200 hits and scored 114 runs. Yeah, it’s part of the rebuild I guess, but I bet Seattle is thrilled to get him. The Marlins are completely weird.
YF
Those two teams sound about right, but I still hope we get Ohtani!
But who wouldn’t want to live in San Diego, especially with plenty of money to spend.
Ohtani would make us stronger, especially in the post season, to take the pressure off Kershaw..
Because top starting pitchers, will be hard to find, with only a couple good pitchers, being free agents , in the next couple of years.
I think watching Ohtani play, will be exciting too.
Guys, new posts
https://ladodgerreport.com/shohei-ohtani-give-dodgers-better-value-pitcher/
https://ladodgerreport.com/heres-newest-youtube-video/