We can witness miracles every day within our day-to-day lives, but they are often rare. I thought I had seen an honest to goodness holy act of god. The Dodgers had nearly gone through the entire spring without any major injuries. Other than Tom Koehler’s sore shoulder, nobody else had gotten hurt. Even Corey Seager’s elbow problems seem to have subsided. But do you think we could have gotten through an entire spring and into opening day without some kind of major blow to the Dodger lineup or rotation? Not a chance. If you thought so then I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news here.
Justin Turner suffered a broken left wrist during the first inning of the Dodger’s 3-1 win over the Oakland A’s on Monday evening at Camelback Ranch. Oakland pitcher Kendall Graveman hit Turner on the wrist with an inside fastball in the bottom of the first inning. Turner fell to the ground and was seen writhing in pain before being led off the field. He was sent for x-rays and we prayed it was nothing too serious.
Not a chance. He was diagnosed with a non-displaced fracture, a small one, but still it’s fractured. Turner will start the season on the disabled list and the Dodgers are already scrambling to figure out what they’re going to do for the first month or so of the regular campaign. Do the Dodgers move Logan Forsythe over to third and play Chase Utley at second? Austin Barnes can play second as well, but then maybe the Dodgers should have Kyle Farmer on the roster as a precaution? Will Enrique Hernandez play second if Forsythe has to play third? So many questions, so little answers, so little time.
And now everything sucks. Turner will have his hand reexamined and the club is confident that he won’t need surgery, but who knows. Turner is the Dodger’s best hitter and as I’ve said before losing him for any extended amount of time is a big problem. We almost saw a miracle folks, but in the end Dodgers spring training returned to normal. There could be a lot of losing in the first month. Thanks a lot Oakland.
I like Michael’s idea of playing Forsythe at 3rd, Taylor at second and keep Thompson to play center field. That would be the sensible and SABRtastic thing to do. Taylor can spell Thompson once in a while and Utley can play second or third once in a while too.
I think given playing time Thompson can surprise and get us more value in a trade during the early part of the season. It’s going to be hard to trade him with the 25 man roster deadline coming up – why would any team offer anything when they think they can have a chance to pick him up off waivers?
Farmer still has options and can tear up the minors and/or work on his catching. And he can pray along with all of us on Grandal finding a new home.
Roberts already said they aren’t moving Taylor to 2nd.
Utley and Hernandez there. Maybe Barnes, but the team doesn’t think he’s a consistent solution there.
Yeah, we know. That doesn’t mean we can’t have a different opinion. Hernandez and his .215 BA, and avg play at second, will be the FAZRoberts choice. Strong up the middle is so old school.
Badger
Strong up the middle might be old school but I know that is the way to go. I agree FAZ and Ro derts love Kiki. That weakens the team for sure. I don’t know why we always have to reinvent the wheel??
Even the old wheel has algorithms. C = πd. That’s one.
I usta like Kiké. That was after he hit .300. Now he looks launch happy, swinging for the fences no matter the count. I’d rather not see him in the lineup every day. But FAZ don’t care what I think.
Frankly I would pay to see Verdugo in there for a few minutes. He could easily get 100 at bats and know what it is he has to work on when he gets sent back down. He could be the best the outfielder we have. I believe he has the best arm in our system. It’s as strong as Puig’s, and I am quite sure more accurate. Maybe he doesn’t have the speed of Toles but his instincts are good. I’d consider it if I were Roberts.
Yeah, it’s my problem. Mine alone.
I never understood that POV, but I respect it.
My thinking is that my opinion is basically useless. I work in marketing, what do I know about baseball.
I just try to root for the team, be optimistic and try to understand the front office’s thinking. It is a lot easier now than with Colletti!
As per Verdugo, would they want to start his “clock” just for a minor injury to Turner? Is his clock started? I don’t think so.
Yeah, I get the clock issue. I’m more concerned about having the best player in there. They didn’t plan on starting Bellinger’s clock last year and that worked out ok. If Verdugo is Major League ready, I think it’s a good thing.
Even if he’s ready and performs, when Turner returns it’s problematic because of the inability to trade Kemp.
Frankly 5 ML ready left fielders has to be a good thing.
I’m not buying the Kemp not tradable idea. If he’s as good as he has looked, he’s tradable. If it turns out you’re right and he’s valueless, they can just cut him loose.
I agree Yueh. Now we will find out just how deep the Dodgers are. All the FAZMANIACS tout the depth that this team has, now we will see exactly if that is true. Farmer can also play 3rd. I am sure they will send Peter to the minors for a while. There are supposed to be, according to Rick Monday, more cuts tomorrow. And I am really hoping Grandal has a new address by July……..
No one wants to see Verdugo or Toles in CF while Taylor goes to 2B? Why Thompson?
Thompson has no options left and will be on waivers soon if we don’t add him to the 25 man roster.
I’d prefer a middle infielder play the middle infield position. Taylor at second and Toles in center. It’s only for 6 weeks. Thompson has been given a lot of at bats this Spring. 11 hits, 8 singles, unimpressive.769 OPS. Also 11 Ks. Verdugo has impressed, but I doubt it’s him over Toles.
Utley, Seager, Pederson and Barnes all look pathetic at the plate. Looking at the team stat page there are several with a high strikeout percentage. It’s Spring so everybody is working on something.
Thompson hit a homer last night. So did Joc and Bellinger. I prefer someone playing 2nd who is going to be there every day. No frippen platoons. Taylor is the best option and have real outfielders in the outfield, not a converted short stop. Thompson if healthy is a pretty damn good outfielder and he has speed.
I worry that Utley is like Gonzalez last year, done.
YF
Just because Thompson does not mean he should get a starting job. Crap remains Crap. Speaking of no value.
Thompson is better than you think…..remember he was injured and as of right now he is not showing any residual signs of that injury.
I think Thompson will play well. He hasn’t looked all that bad to me. And he is a good outfielder.
Bluto
The Dodgers don’t want to trade Kemp, especially after what happened with Turner.
Every team/organization has depth (meaning backups) or at least a contingency plan if something would happen to any of its starters. Only the FAZomaniacs tout the heavy hitting Chase Utley (.240 Dodger career BA, .317 OBP) as quality depth. Or Joc Pederson (with his career BA of .222) or Trayce Thompson (yep, career BA of .233, .310 OBP) or Kiki Hernandez’s career BA of .236, OBP .312 as being quality depth.
Keep in mind the Cardinals traded away Randall Grichuk (who had better overall numbers than Pederson or Thompson or Hernandez) because he wasn’t producing at a high enough level. With the FAZomaniacs he would have been viewed as superior depth.
It’s all how you want to sell it. Since the nucleus of the team was already in place prior to Friedman & Zaidi, the FAZomaniacs can only give the front office credit for its depth which is truly a figment of ones imagination.
As I mentioned last year, every team has the same number of backups and minor league players. Our minor league system was at the top a couple years ago. Not now. Last year we had “depth” at SP because we had pros in McCarthy and Kazmir, and youth with Urias. How’d that work out? I think our SP depth this year is in reality rather thin. I hope I’m proven wrong. Losing Turner obviously hurts this lineup, but according to every projection I’ve seen we had about a 10 game buffer between us and whoever comes in second. We should be fine. Turner will be back and he should be well rested.
Badger
Kazmir wasn’t even part of the picture last year, he never even pitched in a major league spring training game, because his velocity was in the 80s.
And McCarthy wasn’t heard from, for most of the second half of the season.
We probably won’t have Urías, but we do have Buehler for the second part, of the season.
And by the time Darvish came to the team, we already had the West in our hands, so we are really not missing a lot of starting pitching.
But every pitcher in the rotation did go out at one time last year.
Our starting pitching is weak. After Kershaw it is sort of who do you trust. Wood looked great last night and he is Roberts #2. Maeda is the #3 Hill 4 and Ryu 5. But who is there if one of those guys goes down. Well here is what is available that is on the roster. Buehler, Stewart, Stripling, Owens, Neal, and Urias supposedly in August. Font has pitched his way off of the roster pretty much. And he will go on waivers. What they have is an ace and a bunch of 5 inning studs. The bullpen had better be on their game all year. Because I will guarantee you that they are going to be used and used and used. You can also bet that cheapo FAZ will be scouting the waiver wire for any starter or reliever with a pulse who has been injured at one time, can be had for peanuts, and just might throw an inning or two. Our 1-2 punch, Kershaw-Wood is rated the 10th best. Our farm system is down to # 10. FAZ is slipping and their 5 year plan is in year 4. This is why you spend some cash and get a 2nd ace.
Michael
What is an saying we have almost the exact same pitchers, that we had for the first part of the season last year, unless you miss McCarthy.
But I rather have one of our young starting pitchers pitch, then someone like McCarthy, and Kazmir.
And Kazmir is ineffective in the majors, just like the Angels found out.
Chili
Grichuk is very comparable to Joc, because Grichuk only had one part of a season that he hit 270, and that is why after the Cards traded Grichuk for an arm in the bullpen, I thought we should trade Joc for an arm in the bullpen.
Agree MJ.
But the reality is that Grichuk’s numbers are better than many of the ‘quality depth’ replacement players that the FAZomaniacs lament about.
Here’s an organization (Cardinals) that said screw depth. We are going to better our team with the thought that there are always players that can hit .249 (Grichuk’s career ave) available if needed.
Like you identified, why not trade VERY REPLACEABLE guys for arms (bullpen or starters) that will more than likely be needed.
Many of the GM’s/Presidents around the league (Cardinals included) are not being paid $7M per year and yet they seem to understand when a player has shown his true colors and needs to be moved.
Finally some drama. In previous administrations this would have meant some type of trade. With these guys it’s move the chess pieces around. Boy that’s exciting!
My coffee money is on Logan at 3B and Kike/Utley at 2B. FAZ said they prefer Taylor in CF.
The first thing I thought after Turner got hurt, was how long will he be out.
If he has a clean break, he will be out, at the most 8 weeks, or 6 weeks.
The positive thing about Turner missing this time, is he won’t be as beat up, and tired, at the end of the season.
The second thing I thought, it is a good thing we have Kemp’s bat in the line up, now.
Kemp is not the same hitter Turner is, but Kemp is very capable of hitting for an average, and he has more power then Turner, but Kemp does strike out more, then Turner.
Turner went out last year for 4 weeks, because he pulled is hammy, and if Turner has a clean break, he should heal fast.
Hopefully it isn’t a bad break, where he is going to need a surgery, because that might be harder for Turner to come back.
Last night on the post game show, I heard Kike, and Farmer.
If Farmer can continue to hit like he has, he deserves to make the roster.
He can play third, and he thinks he can also play shortstop if he is needed.
Farmer played shortstop in college, the Dodgers moved him to catcher.
Farmer just might out hit Forsythe, if he is given consistent at bats.
What I read about Thompson, was the Dodgers we’re going to try to trade him.
It is not a major break MJ. But he will be reassessed in a couple of days. They wrapped it real tight to keep the swelling down. Read the write up on mlb.com for all the info. They have Thompson on the trading block, but for the reason I listed below, he can be had on waivers, why would anyone give up anything for him now unless they felt that they really wanted the guy and were afraid another team would grab him. The versatility that so many Dodger players possess will come into play now, but personally, I would put Taylor back in the infield where he is a far better player and is more natural there.
Michael
I don’t really have a lot of faith with Thompson, because even his minor league numbers are not that great, but I do like him a lot, as a person.
But I do think your right that Thompson will more likely be lost, because like you said, why would a team trade for Thompson, when a team can just wait until the Dodgers let him, go.
I will say this about Thompson, at least you can tell he worked with someone on his hitting, in the off season, and I can not say the same thing, about Joc.
That is what bothers me about Joc, he shows up to spring training every year, and doesn’t have a swing down, and he is not ready to hit.
No they are not. But he is a better outfielder than most, and has had some success in the majors..his problem has been the injuries. Turner does not need surgery..latest report as of 1 hr ago.
I agree with your assessment, Artieboy
Here is my reasoning on Thompson. He is a natural center fielder. He has some pop in that bat, speed and a good arm. The Dodgers lose him for nothing unless they can make a trade which teams are not going to want to do when they can claim him on waivers. They could also keep Farmer and put him at 3rd and keep Forsythe at 2nd base. I do not believe that Joc Pederson is going to make this roster. I do not think Kike can handle the job every day. Nor do I think that Utley is going to revert to 10 years ago and tear the cover off the ball. Some players are going to have to up their games to take up the slack. Here is another thing to remember. It is a wrist injury. Werth had one of those when he was with the Dodgers and he was not the same when he first came back. Justin is a tough game player, but expecting him to pop back in the lineup 6 weeks from now and be Justin Turner 2017 version is a pipe dream. It will take him a while to be back to what he was. Suck it up Dodgers, now we will see what you guys can do without your best bat in the lineup.
Everyone is forgetting that we have Kemp’s bat in the line up now, and we didn’t have Kemp when Turner was out for four weeks, when he pulled his hammy last year.
I am not forgetting Matt at all. But who replaced Turner last year at 3rd? Does anyone even remember? A break is a lot different than a hammy pull. I think Matt will do fine, but there still is a hole there now. Replacing the bat is the hardest part. Defensively, they have guys who can do the job.
Forsythe replaced Turner at third, and maybe Farmer can also help in the infield.
I don’t dislike Kike, but he is not the first one that came to my mind last night.
We know they are going to move everyone around, so there will not be just one person playing third, but I expect Forsythe to play third most of the time, like he did last year.
Hopefully Forsythe will hit righties this year.
They blame his early injuries for not hitting righties last year, but he had no trouble at all, hitting lefties last year.
I think Kiké and Forsythe split the duty at third last year.
Non-displaced fracture is actually the good news. Depending on what bone broke, I believe there 8 in the wrist, and if the crack is through the bone or not. Both Tim and I are familiar with wrist breaks. I had a comminuted fracture in my left wrist in college. Radius and ulna cracked like egg shells. Went from a deep gap hitter to a shallow gap hitter in hardball and from a home run hitter to a singles hitter in softball. It was a big deal. Tim’s X-ray looked like a tiny grenade went off in his wrist joint. Turners injury initially sounds far less serious. Hopefully no joint damage occurred. 6 weeks. He will heal quickly, I just know it.
Badger
Kike is not good at third, and he hasn’t played third a lot.
I read that a displaced fracture is when the bone didn’t move, out of place.
I broke my wrist cardboard sliding when I was 8 years old.
And on the day I was suppose to get my cast off, they found out my bone was even farther out of place, so I had to have my wrist rebroken, and put back into place.
And I had to wear a soft cast, for another month or 6 weeks.
The hardest thing for Turner, will be trying to get full motion, back into his wrist.
Worst news I read this morning was that Grandal is going to get the bulk of the work behind the plate….the passed ball machine is back…damn….
Squirrel got a handful of nuts the past week. Passed balls? Squirrel looks passed balls, he’s got nuts.
Forsythe started 31 games at 3rd last year, Kike started 8. Forsythe made 3 errors in 31 games, Kike made 1 in 8 games. Farmer played 7 innings at 3rd. Farmer is playing great right now and is playing 3rd today….Puig 2 for 3 with 2 doubles and 4 ribbies.
That is good to hear about Puig, I am with Package, let’s start the real baseball now!
MJ
That is correct, let’s start the real baseball now!!!
By the way, nice to see people coming back and posting more now that spring training is almost past us. Hope everyone has had a pleasant winter break. I’ve been trying to get back in shape for the beach after an entire winter hibernating with beer – ha ha.
Starting rotation has looked good this week. Kershaw, Wood, Maeda, all looked solid. I like Hill, but his last outing was poor, but he has a way of sustaining his game. Not a bad 4th SP. Ryu I have no confidence in. My nostalgia has long disappeared for him. His performance of the past seems to be in the past. Sorry to be so negative about him.
If we don’t move Forsythe to 3B, I would not be adverse to trying Farmer there. He has the kind of bat that could easily make up for the loss of Turner’s power. No idea what kind of fielder he is, though.
If Forsythe does move to 3B, Kike and Utley are the likely choices. Isn’t that why the signed Utley? I’m not in favor of Utley because players like Kike have looked much better than they have in the past and deserve the chance to prove themselves. Otherwise, moveing Taylor to 2B and putting Verdugo or Toles in CF is my choice. Both of these players deserve the start, especially Toles and the way he has comeback from injury last year. We don’t lose any hitting or power. Thompson has never impressed consistently. He’s another slumper.
One of my main questions for this team is when is Corey Seager going to play like an all-star? He has not lived up to his hype, is a slumper, and has the kind of Bellinger body that can do real damage to opponents. I don’t see him as a consistent elite player as many fans do. He’s not a Grandal, but he should be delivering a lot more than he has. What gives? Are there nagging injuries that don’t go away? Is it mental? He’s been terrible in ST.
Verdugo sent to the minors. I have more faith in Ryu than I do Hill who is nothing more than a 5 inning guy and consistently puts the Dodgers behind the 8 ball in the first inning. Forsythe will be at 3rd, Utley and Kike, who is a lousy hitter will alternate at 2nd. According to Roberts, Farmer is hitting his way onto the team. He is versatile, can play 3rd, SS and C. Liberatore also optioned. Font actually pitched 2 innings without giving up a run. Venditte still in the bullpen mix.
I think Hill is what he is. He is not going to average 6 innings and while he will throw a stinker here and there, he can generally last 5 innings but it will take him 90 pitches to get there.
From a predictability point of view, how Ryu will do this year is hard to say. I am not sure he will average 6 innings either and I would not want to push him much. But if Ryu is back to 90%-95% what he was in his last healthy year, or even 85%, he is a better pitcher than Hill.
One more thought on Ryu. While most would agree he is a question mark, I think he is less of a question mark at this point than the likes of McCarthy and Kazmir. With Ryu, it’s about his health. With McCarthy and Kazmir, they are questionable MLB starters even when fully healthy.
After considering my own take on up the middle importance I asked myself – who’s more valuable defensively, second base or centerfield. I think yesteryear it might have been closer. Today’s it about launch angle. Today it’s about outfield.
I checked statcast to see the Top 10 of dWAR last year. 3 were center fielders. None were second baseman. And, according to that chart Hernandez and Taylor were equal. I would not have guessed that. So, either could play both positions. That’s kinda cool.
We didn’t get Utley to play second full time. He was to spell Forsythe. I think he’s not going to get that many more at bats because of this. Those at bats will go to Hernandez. Honestly, if Hernandez and Taylor are equal in center, I might still lean toward Taylor at second. His natural position is shortstop.
On position defense, I agree these days the CF position on defense is more important than second base.
But give a choice of Thompson+Toles platoon-CF/Taylor-2B or Taylor-CF/Kiki-2B, I think I take Thompson+Toles platoon-CF/Taylor -2B as the superior defensive combination. And with Kiki being so inconsistent, I am not sure it is a given that Thompson will be worse than Kiki offensively either.
And I don’t think Kiki is not OF. Definitely not a good CF. Defensively I would rather have Kemp, Toles and Thompson, and in late innings I want to see Toles and Thompson.
Don’t know what these people know, but Thompson and Pederson are down the list.
http://losangeles.dodgers.mlb.com/team/depth_chart/index.jsp?c_id=la
Kemp, Taylor and Puig sounds good to me.
Coming down to the nitty gritty……..no game today, Angels tomorrow night. Orioles set to sign Cobb. Anderson, yep Brett, signs with the A’s…..Ethier still with no job…….