The Dodgers faced the Cubs and old friend Brett Anderson in an afternoon game today with barely a breeze blowing.
With each team winning a tough game so far, this rubber match would probably be won by the winds created by the team who wanted it more. Justin Turner returned to the lineup after sitting out last night’s contest, so he could be the difference-maker. Then again, Scott Van What’s-He-Still-Doing-Here? and Kike were starting also, so there was that to contend with.
Hyun-Jin Ryu took to the mound for the Dodgers. He gave up a first inning home run to Anthony Rizzo, and the way the afternoon turned out – much like Andrew Toles‘ homer last night – that was really all the margin needed.
The Dodgers opened the fourth inning with some hope of a rally in the form of two on and no out. Here’s how they spoiled that:
Scott Van Waste-of-a-Roster-Spot couldn’t bunt, so he wasted an out. Yasmani Grandal grounded out, but advanced the runners. Then Trayce Thompson bounced out to trash yet another scoring opportunity.
The Dodgers’ failure to score came back to bite them when Addison Russell took Ryu deep for a solo homer in their half of the fourth. Cubs 2 – 0.
The boys managed to load the bases again in the fifth. Yasiel Puig came up with those loaded bases and two out. The Cubs cashed in on his over-aggressiveness and played him like a piano. They came at him very low and away, and at least he didn’t bit at that one. Puig then swung at and missed a high fastball for strike one. Then he watched one go right down the pipe for strike two, and he popped up and out on another high strike. The only pitch he should have swung at was the one he didn’t. *sigh*
The Cubs rallied in the fifth to score another two runs and knock Ryu out of the game. After five it was Cubs 4, Dodgers 0.
It could have been worse, however, but Kiké Enrique Hernandez made a great play to save a run. He charged in from LF to back up Turner on a throw from Puig out in right. Turner couldn’t handle the throw, but Kiké was there to field the ricochet and throw Schwarber out at the plate. It was an outstanding play!
That, and continued magnificence by the bullpen were the last positive things for the Dodgers today. They went quietly over the last few innings and lost 4-0.
They may have won one game, but across the series, the Cubs schooled the Dodgers in how to look like a Worlds Champion. The boys limp home with a .500 record, stuck in third place, and will now face their NL West opponents, the Diamondbacks and the Rockies.
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Team with RISP: (It’s really better you don’t look) 0 for 10
Ryu (0-2) went 4 2/3 innings with 6 hits, 4 runs, 5 Ks and 2 walks. ERA 5.79
Oscar Martinez
I was born in the shadow of Dodger Stadium and immediately drenched in Dodger Blue. Chavez Ravine is my baseball cathedral, Vin Scully was the golden voice of summer all my life, and Tommy Lasorda remains the greatest Dodgers manager ever. My favorite things are coffee, beer, and the Dodgers beating the Giants. I also blog about my baseball card hobby at All Trade Bait, All the Time.
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These games are getting hard to watch. I admit, I checked in and out of all three games, so I may have missed a few things, but this roster really needs some help. Leave Puig alone at 8, don;t get greedy and think he is ready to breakthru, he is what he is, please leave him batting 8.
Amazing, and our payroll is what?
They lost to Brett Anderson! Yes that Brett Anderson the same guy who pitched all of 1 game and made 15.6 million doing so………..embarrassing.
All sorts of sources saying the Dodgers and Brewers are still talking about a trade for Ryan Braun since he becomes a 10-5 player next month. No talk of anyone who is involved, but Braun is hitting .214 with 2 dingers and 4 ribbies. Puig is hitting .265 with 3 homers and 5 ribbies. Does not seem like much of an upgrade to me unless you are going to stick him in LF.
Braun would probably be a sizable upgrade in left field over the course of a full year. Probably. But at what cost? And, would that move make us better than the Cubs? I don’t see it. The Cubs were better last year, and they are better again this year. If Braun can still do it for a full year, he’s 33 so I would think he could, he would help, but again, at what cost? You know FAZ. They will likely overpay.
Well, the Giants aren’t looking much better. They’ve got some big holes. And Buster Posey getting concussed by a bean ball could loom large. How many foul tips to the mask can he take? Is his future behind the plate at risk?
Rockies and DBacks are out of the gates well, but can that last especially for the Rockies who are getting dinged up – Jon Gray left last nite’s contest. Padres aren’t playing so bad.
Interesting division, looked like one of best preseason, but the two favorites have some issues to sort out. It’s early.
With the Giants also seeking Braun’s services……someone is going to overpay. Not sure what the Giants can offer and in reality the Dodgers can put together a very lucrative package if so desire.
The issue becomes what 3 young players are going to go. The Brewers want no part of Kazmir, McCarthy, Ethier or Gonzalez as some have suggested pawning off. Their window is 2-5 years out.
Oh course they don’t. But the Brewers are also tired of looking at 33 yr old Braun’s remaining $72M salary over the next four yrs. Like you said their window is 2-5 yrs out, eating $32M on Kazmir over the next two yrs in order to acquire some good prospects might look very good to them. It doesn’t appear that teams are lining up to get Braun and his remaining $72M salary.
Oh, I don’t know about that. He’s 4 years younger than Hill, so for sure FAZ would be interested. And unlike a lot of contracts his was front loaded and goes down every year after $20 million in ’18. He has consistently put up the WAR to more than earn his money. 72 million is only 9 WAR over 5 years. He got half that last year. I think there will be a few teams that will be interested in him, the giants are definitely one of them. He would change the hell out that lineup.
I know $24M doesn’t go as far as it used to, but Hill is signed for $24M less than Braun’s remaining salary. Braun could help or hurt a lineup and more so than Hill, because he is a position player, he can block a potential young stud if he isn’t producing. See Adrian Gonzalez.
Chili might be right, “someone will OVERPAY”, I just hope it isn’t the Dodgers.
You could be wrong, Braun might not be decrepit enough to interest FAZ…
Box-
If it’s me representing the Brewers Mgmt., I’m not taking Kazmir and his $32M contract. Not what I would be seeking. I would be looking to move Braun’s salary and acquire a couple or three top prospects in return. The first team that can make that happens, wins. Yes, the prize is Ryan Braun and his remaining 4 year contract. If you (or FAZ was telling me to pay some of his contract…..oh, I’ll pay some BUT you are going to pay for me paying…..in other words, I’m now taking 4 major league ready players. Now how much do you want me to pay?)
And I am sure you would do your best for the Brewers!
If I am representing the DODGERS, I tell you I need Braun to be close to 2018 luxury tax neutral. It’s real important to me (I know you and your Brewer CO-GM’s know this already). Braun’s $21M/yr luxury tax hit only costs me an extra $5M in luxury tax wages in 2018 over Kazmir ($16M/yr average). You taking Kazmir still saves you about $40M total. WIN/WIN
Yes, I can do better on the prospects because you took Kazmir, but FOUR f___ing prospects for Braun? You do know he has been hitting around the Mendoza line this year don’t you? And you do know the boys at LAdodgerreport will be using my name in vain if I give you FOUR prospects for OLD, JUICEing, SICKLY Braun don’t you? What FOUR middling prospects you want??? OH, and don’t forget I got Dickson in AAA, you want him? If you think you can do better dealing with a bunch of Midgets, more power to you!!
Your move!!
The reason Braun’s name keeps coming up is that the Brewers keep bringing it up. He’s going to be a declining, overpaid 5&10 player for a team that’s rebuilding. Why not try to create a market for him.
Let’s deconstruct together. If you for whatever inane reason are very bullish on this potential acquisition, then you probably have convinced yourself there was the “near miss” deal last August.
Fine. BUT there are no indications that the talks got real serious over this past winter and nothing really in Morosi’s report intimates that there is a deal that’s anywhere close to being completed now. Not with the Dodgers and definitely not with the Giants. Nothing. Nada. Niente. It’s all spin (as I said, probably from Milwakee.)
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Despite the Dodgers LHP woes (and the Giants general OF ineptitude), why should wither want or have to give up anything of consequence? Braun controls where he goes, his play is declining and his cost is high. On the other side of the equation\, if the Brewers weren’t backing off their asking price last season and think they may have a market, why would they now?
Old declining players have remarkably little value in the league. I think Braun, like Ethier, Kazmire and Gonzalez, stays a Brewer, and they stay Dodgers, through 2017 at least. It’s a good thing the Dodgers are a larger market team.
Bluto-
Might be one of the few times that I agree with your statement/assessment of the situation.
I do think someone will trade for Braun at some point. His maximum value to the Brewers is now (or by May something, prior to his 10/5 kicking in). After that he will have to approve a trade and that alone will limit who the Brewers can even talk to about moving him.
After thinking this through if I’m the Dodgers I would not trade for him until after he becomes 10/5. Dodgers will have much more leverage at that point BUT if I’m the Brewers Management I’m looking to move him before he becomes 10/5.
For the record, I’m not in support of trading for Braun. To me at this point he’s not worth 3 prospects/contract controlled major leaguers.
AND I definitely agree with this ‘Old declining players have remarkably little value in the league.’ FAZ has acquired enough for 3 franchises….but we are known as the LA Tampa A’s.
Send him to SF! With their cavernous left field, Braun would be quite a defensive liability there.
“Old declining players have remarkably little value in this league”
Really? Have you not heard of the FAZ?
Hey, I’m not saying we should do this, but, depending on who goes the other way, I could live with it. This guy can still hit. He put up 3.8 oWAR last year. He’s only 33, and yes, he’s got DH written all over him but he’s no worse a left fielder than who we are putting out there now.
Bite your tongue Artie. Veterans going to SF have a way of putting it together for Bochy.
FAZ is a testament to adhering to and trying to find Value!
My eyes are going bad. For a minute there I thought you said FAZ was a testicle, and I was going to agree he was the next thing to it…
I saw that too! We both are losing our marbles and eyesight!
Jonah
Now you are only giving them credit for only one ball, or I mean, testicle?
I use the word ‘cajones’, sounds better than the clinical term or the street term.
Well said…Cojones is a good word, sheep dip is a good word for this offense.
Neither Rich Hill nor McCarthy were declining at the stage in their careers when they were signed. Actually, it was quite the opposite. It was age or previous injury that allowed the Dodgers to sign them for under market value.
Under market value? I didn’t, and still don’t, see it that way. We outbid ourselves on those two and Kazmir. I find it curious that in one post aging players aren’t valuable, but in another paragraph it’s “unless FAZ signed them.”
I’m reluctant to speak for Bluto because you’re referring to his comment, but if you read his comment without redacting the key information, it says that old and DECLINING players – and I would add “old and declining players with expensive contracts” – have little value.
I’ll repeat my point: Neither of those two players were declining. In fact, quite the opposite.
As for value, using your handy 7 mil/1 WAR formula that you often cite, the 3.6 WAR Hill put up last year, in addition to the 2.12 ERA and 1.00 WHIP, equates to $25.2 million per year on the open market.
Performance has value. The Dodgers are paying for the best curveball thrower in baseball.
Contract yrears should not be trusted. Using that logic Greinke was worth $65 million. The cost per WAR that fangraphs has calculated is not to be used like that. But you know that. It’s funny where we all go to prove a point. We have our own spin rate when we post.
I don’t trust Hill. You do. I didn’t trust McCarthy nor did I trust Kazmir. We’ll see where it goes.
The $/WAR calculation was somewhat meant to be cheeky.
It’s not that I trust Hill. I just think, based on his performance – even factoring in injury potential – it wasn’t a bad signing.
Under market value? You really need to lay off the Blue Kool-Aid.
NO ONE was offering RICH hill $16M per for 3 years. NO ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
RICH hill ONLY pitched well last year because it was his contract year. He suckered your FAZ into signing him to a 3 year deal. Watch and learn.
IF FAZ was as smart as you think he is the prior year they would have signed RICH hill to a 4 year deal worth…..oh, $20M total. RICH hill would have jumped all over that.
Your liberal use of the ALL CAPS function and exclamation points don’t make your post any less nonsensical.
The Dodgers had wanted to sign him the previous winter. They had been doing their due diligence in analyzing his skills, and got to see him up close after they traded for him. They knew who they were getting.
But no, his 2.12 ERA, 12 wins and spin rate and PitchFX data were all an elaborate ruse, a facade to dupe this gullible front office into signing him. Because his performance was all an act, all smoke and mirrors, he will quickly be found out and revert back to mediocrity, but laughing all the way to the bank.
Even if true that this was just some long con, an elaborate swindle, the 48 million pales in comparison to the Madoff-like performance Greinke put up in his contract year in 2015. That resulted in him defrauding the Dbacks to the tune of 206 milion – and he actually has come crashing back to Earth.
Thanks for replying to this dodgerpatch. I almost did, but like Chili, I do work to pay other posters S.S. Following is a reminder of all the teams pursing Hill and hoping to sign him for around 3 yrs, $50M.
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/11/latest-on-market-for-rich-hill.html
Good find with that link. So, there WERE other suitors for Hill and he WAS signed for under market value.
oh wait… !!!!!!!!!….definitely need more exclamation points.
“There’s plenty of reason to tamper contract expectations, of course. Even if one accepts that Hill can continue to mow down opposing hitters, he’s not young and comes with a long history of injuries. And it’s certainly possible that he’s in line for some regression in the earned-run department after limiting opposing hitters to just 0.33 home runs per nine innings a season ago.”
I’ve tampered my expectations.
They said similar b.s. about McCarthy when he had a good year. I still prefer to get younger and stronger.
Just keep making stuff up and treating it like fact Chili.
It’s a very mature and advanced method of discussion.
I don’t think the Giants will rush out and get Braun, that isn’t what the Giants front office does.
And really Braun is no sure thing, he has had injury problems, in that past too.
He had a nerve problem in his hand, and that affected how he was able to hold a bat.
Maybe they should try to see what the almost everyday line up can do, against lefties, instead of staying with this platoon line up all year, like they did, last year, unsuccessfully.
Logan was suppose to be the bat, that got us over the problem, with lefties.
He hasn’t hit well, in key situations, and he still has the most strike outs, on the team.
And Joc and Grandal, are not suddenly, becoming contact hitters.
That is for you Chili!
Well personally I do not think they will trade for Braun unless Milwaukee eats some of his salary and they do not have to trade top notch talent for him. We have some people in the minors playing pretty well right now so why not call up Segedin, and Eibner, and yes, Okoye Dickson. They are all doing very well at OKC, send Kike, SVS and Thompson back down. Thompson obviously needs AB’s to knock the rust off. Dickson is raking down there, RH hitter with power, who can play 3rd 1st or the outfield. And MJ, Forsythe was supposed to be part of the fix against lefty’s. All the other so called lefty bashers need to do their jobs too. As for Gonzo, it took him a while to heat up last year, and he is a consummate pro, I have no problem with his production, he will get his homers and ribbies. But someone has to be on base. Roberts said yesterday that they were all trying to hard, and that could be the truth, Turner said basically the same thing. There is no quick fix per-se. But I definitely do not think Braun is the answer….Cespedes, maybe, but the Mets are not trading that guy. By the way, they are going to see 3 lefty’s in the next 4 games, so they had better figure something out quick…..Ray, Corbin and Freeland again when the Rockies get here…….
Michael
I just said above that Logan was suppose to be the answer, to the leftie problem.
But take a look at his stats, you and I were pointing out, stuff about our young players, and Logan is getting consistent at bats, and our young players are not.
I wouldn’t say much about his stats, because it is early, but he has to many strike outs, and he is suppose to be the answer, to the leftie problems.
I am not concerned about Agone like some people are, because he isn’t the worse part of the problem, even though he isn’t hitting, with power.
The point is that he is hitting consistently.
Didn’t you say that Segedin was hitting 250 in AAA?
I just don’t think he will hit that well at the major league level, because he won’t be playing everyday, and he is only hitting 250 at AAA.
But you are right, they have to try something different.
The problem is it isn’t the regular line up, that are not hitting lefties.
That is what the platoon line up, is doing against lefties, and maybe Corey and Turner, and sometimes Agone.
And Puig doesn’t have a hit against lefties this year, either.
The irony is that Logan Forsythe is performing close to his averages. He has always struck out a lot. His current average of .229 is not too far from his career average of .254. Hell, he’s tearing it up OBP wise as he is at .357 (career avg. is .326). Other than one more hit that being a HR he is performing to his career numbers.
What more should anyone expect.
FAZ, The Czar of Mediocrity…
MJ my only point is this, one player, IE. Logan Forsythe is not going to be the solution to that problem. He is a piece of the puzzle, nothing more. He has been decent against lefty’s in his career, but so have SVS and Gutierrez and Kike. Not one of those guys is doing the job so far. Logan is striking out too much. In his defense, he is in a new league 10 games in and facing pitchers he has pretty much not seen very often and some he has never seen. Well know what they are doing against LHP. Puig is off to a terrible start against LH’s, but I believe like Roberts does, that they are all trying to hard. They are not relaxed up there, the approach by most of them is one of impatience. Forsythe over the prior 3 years hit .272 against lefty’s with 19 homers and a OPS of 802. Puig over the same span .263 with 13 dingers and a 795 OPS. Kike, .270 with 9 homers and a 840 OPS. SVS .282 with 12 homers and a 896 OPS. Turner, .249 13 homers and a 739 OPS. Grandal .223 5 homers and a 685 OPS. Gonzalez, .247 10 HR’s and a 659 OPS. Gutierrez, .293 20 Homers and a 916 OPS. Seager .263 7 homers and a 758 OPS.. and just because he has been discussed. Ryan Braun..312 21 homers and a 926 OPS. Okay, the point is this, if and I mean if, these guys were hitting anywhere near their production the last 3 seasons, there would not be that much of a problem. Grandal should definitely not be starting against lefty’s, no matter what Dave Roberts said, he does not make them better. Seager should be in the lineup every day period. Forsythe and Puig if they hit their numbers will be fine, Gutierrez the same, but health will be a question with him SVS and Kike are mysteries because they did it before, but now seem less capable in that role. I would let Toles hit against all comers until he proves he cannot. He could not be much worse than VanSlyke has been or Kike. Pederson the same, let him hit until he proves he cannot. He has been better so far this year against lefty’s than RH. As for Braun, although he would be an upgrade on offense, his age and defense is iffy.
I’m thinking FAZ will give these guys time to get it going. It’s too early to pull the trigger on Braun. But, I really hope he doesn’t go to a Division rival.
Michael
Scott hasn’t done much, in three years, and Kike had that one good year, and it has been two years, since then.
I did worry about a player coming into a new league, with all new pitchers, but offensively, he has been as bad as Reddick, in his first month.
Logan has only hit in one run, and he has only has one extra base hit, which was a double, and struck out 13 times.
His batting average against lefties, is in the high 300s, but half of his strike outs, are against lefties.
All of these pitchers, are new, for Toles too.
I am not worried about Puig, he has had even splits, and I know he can hit 250 with his eyes closeed, but is he going to take it to the next level, is really the question.
Michael
But I know where you are coming from!
There are obvious holes, and a lot of this has to do with the way FAZ builds his teams. As for SVS, I give him a little leeway because in 2015 and 16 he was injured a lot. Kike I give no break because he has been healthy the last 2 years. His drop off was terrible and he has not been any better this year, but both should be on a very short leash. Gutierrez is unavailable for at least a couple weeks, and then will need some reps to be ready. Yes, the pitchers are new for Toles as well. But like I said, at this point, I put him in the lineup every day just to see if he can hit lefty’s. Otherwise his speed is lost to the Dodgers the next 3 games after tonight.
Segedin’s avg has been climbing. Close to .300 now…
The statements made by some that a team will face RH 70%-75% of the time might just fly in the face of the 2017 LA Dodgers. The trend has been set to push back, call up or promote lefties to the rotation in time for the Dodgers series.
I’m waiting for the time where some lefty is dinged up or tired and before he goes on the DL to recuperate they wait until after the Dodgers series.
LHP…….’Coach that last outing, my arm felt weak. I think it’s from the 5 straight quality starts.’
Coach….’Well we do have the Dodgers series this coming weekend. We need all lefties on board. They are batting .199 vs lefties as a team.’
LHP……’ .199 coach? I’ll ice my arm and shoulder more than normal. I’ll take the ball and give you a strong 5 innings.’
Coach…..’Excellent. That’s all we need. They set their starting lineup for a lefty and then half way through the game they change out many of their hitters. If the game is close at the end, we’ll have the matchup advantage. Oh, by the way, we’ll give you 10 days off after that start.’
LHP….. ‘Excellent.’
I agree Chili. Until we do something that changes the course, a mediocre lefty is the order of the day against the Dodgers.
MJ, I think the giants would be interested in Braun. He had 4.4 WAR last year. If he could put up 3 WAR this year he helps that team and earns his $20 million. Next year? Same thing. 3 WAR $20 million. The way he mashes lefties he could continue being valuable just doing that. Starting in ’19, age 35, his salary is $19mm then ’17mm. In ’21 there is a mutual option of $15mm or a $4mm buyout. If he continues to hit, that contract might not be that difficult to move to the AL.
I leave Puig in there and bat him 8th. Give him 500 at bats and he will produce. Plus, he’s one of the players everybody wants to see. We don’t have a lineup full of must see everyday players. He and Seager are at the top of our list.
Badger
I think the Giants would only do that, if Posey can’t play.
Chili
Bryce Harper’s team mates, once said, that Harper said he was hurting, because he didn’t want to face, the late Jose Fernandez.
But of course, when Fernandez was a live, and pitching.
I should certainly hope so…
If you have the same hitters and same coaches, why expect a different result?
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After 10 games, Dodgers are 1-4 against lefty starters and 4-1 against righties.
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After 10 games Dodgers splits are as follows:
Lefties – .211/.293/.320/.612
Righties – .260/.374/.463/.838
Yeah, it’s early but this is just like last year (or worse)
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After 10 games Dodgers are hitting .200/.356/.338/.694 with RISP (they are 23rd in BA with RISP. Last year they finished 23rd with RISP.)
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In “late and close situations” (7th inning or later and within 1 run) Dodgers are hitting .132/.267/.132/.398.
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The Dodgers have played one series against what is arguably the best team (Cubs), one against maybe the worst (Pads) and one that is average (Rox), so this is a pretty even sample.
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Why would the Dodgers give up anything of consequence to improve against lefties? Because if they don’t, teams will continue to rearrange their rotations to insure that the Dodgers face lefties more often than league average and they will continue to stink against them.
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The Dodgers signed free agents to over $190MM in contracts during the off-season with the assumption that they would be in line to compete for a shot at the Series. Why would they do that if they didn’t intend to improve in areas where improvement is needed in order to compete for a shot at the Series?
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As to the starting pitching, again it’s early but the early returns show the Dodgers with a solid pen but iffy starting pitching. Hill and Kazmir already on DL; Ryu with already declining velocity, below average rotation and 2 starts of less than 5 innings, and 2 very good early starts from McCarthy. Ryu will have to come out of the rotation soon.
Because they don’t have the same hitters?
Other than Forsyth, they have the same regulars. Add Gutierrez as an additional RH hitter. Neither have particularly distinguished themselves thus far.
Dodgers are still poor situational hitters.
Agree with that. But FGut and Forsythe were purchased to improve hitting against lhp. Now we have Thompson, who is also a f.n.g.. Sort of.
How much time do they give these guys? No need to panic yet, but, if it ain’t working after ……. 30 games? 50 games? Next week?
Guys, new post up top