Every sportswriter and blogger who has dared to step outside the white lines of the playing field to offer his or her opinion on something not directly related to sports has heard it – “Why are you commenting on (insert subject) – I read this, or watch, or listen to this, for (insert sport), not to get your opinion on anything else!”
I understand that sentiment. But there come times when a writer is compelled to go above and beyond the boxscore. Today one of my fellow Dodgers writers, Daniel Brim from “Dodgers Digest”, took a great big swing at the arguably non-baseball topic of the newly imposed ban on Muslims from selected countries, which denies them admittance into the United States.
Brim’s article “The Muslim Ban and Sticking to Baseball” is well worth a read, and I’m here to add LA Dodger Report’s voice to his call for the Dodgers and Major League Baseball to take a stand on the discriminatory ban. He did an excellent job of laying out the historical international numbers for baseball, and how this ban might affect MLB’s desire to expand their brand worldwide.
The Dodgers are in the right position to take a lead in this morally correct stand. They certainly have the history and the gravitas, hard-earned through leading the integration of baseball with the signing of the first African-American baseball player, Jackie Robinson. You think that wasn’t political? It’s impact was felt in almost every aspect of American life. If that aint political, then I don’t know what is.
The Dodgers have a long history in leading baseball’s expansion into the international ranks. They introduced us to Fernando Valenzuela (Mexico), Chan Ho Park (Korea), Hideo Nomo (Japan), and Yasiel Puig (Cuba). They have an Okinawan-born manager who’s parents are African-American and Japanese, and the examples go on and on.
The blind hatred that supports the Muslim ban is antithetical to the Dodgers’ culture. When Dodger exec Al Campanis made statements that African-Americans “may lack the necessities” to be major league managers, the Dodgers didn’t brush it off as “locker room talk”. Campanis was quickly shown the door, because it was the right thing to do.
Now the right thing is to speak out against the prejudice and hatred this un-American ban is built upon. I’m commenting from a little ol’ baseball blog; but if the Dodgers and MLB weighed in, they would be commenting with one of the biggest microphones available.
This article’s lead photo features two signs that read “I love my Muslim neighbors” and “Refugees welcome”. Last night I played poker with my friend of 17 years, an Iranian Muslim, so I know people directly affected by the ban. But you didn’t come here to read about my friends. You want baseball connections, right? Here’s one: Daniel Brim points out in his article the father of Yu Darvish is an Iranian Muslim. Because of the ban, he won’t be able to travel to the states to see his own son play baseball. This ban is certainly real for Yu Darvish.
Today they are excluding Muslims from seven countries, and it’s a greasy, slippery, slimy slope to banning all Muslims. Observe how fast this ban was implemented, and how bold they are in enforcing all of it, despite federal court orders to cease some aspects. The ban very well might be unconstitutional, and it is certainly immoral. This is just a first step, and one that must be resisted and pushed back on.
When the Dodgers outbid several other teams to sign Yasiel Puig, they hung a big sign over Dodger Stadium’s door that said the same thing as that marcher’s sign: “Refugees Welcome”. Puig is not a unique case. MLB has had plenty of high profile bidding wars for Cuban refugees.
I get it. You’re probably saying, “That’s not the same thing as being a Syrian refugee.” Agreed.
That said, if MLB and the Dodgers can extend their arms wide open for gifted athletes that will bring them hundreds of millions of dollars in revenue, they can certainly hold out a hand for an innocent child.
Oscar Martinez
I was born in the shadow of Dodger Stadium and immediately drenched in Dodger Blue. Chavez Ravine is my baseball cathedral, Vin Scully was the golden voice of summer all my life, and Tommy Lasorda remains the greatest Dodgers manager ever. My favorite things are coffee, beer, and the Dodgers beating the Giants. I also blog about my baseball card hobby at All Trade Bait, All the Time.
Follow Me:
Stick to the Dodgers
How did you completely miss every reference to the Dodgers in the article?
Oscar
You did what was needed, good job!
I watched no NFL due to political BS….Direct TV lost out. I no longer subscribe to NBA League Pass due to their political BS. If MLB, or my Dodgers join in, goodbye to them too. Sports is NOT politics. As a reader from Day 1 to LA Dodger Report, I will NOT read again and will wipe you from my puter. This country is so f*cked up, and people like you Oscar, that feel they must insert their sorry whiny opinions on a sports site, deserve all that you are going to get in the future when it all explodes. Take your cry baby attitude back over the border.
Sorry to lose you as a reader jim. I know Oscar was not trying to insert his opinion on anyone. I think he was just expressing his opinion on a hot topic that effects everyone and effects everyone all across the country including all sports which include baseball.
I think we’ll need to start an off-topic politics thread so we can move all of the political talk away from the primary direction of this site which is Dodger baseball. However we will always support free discussion over here as long as everyone can be civil to each other.
Jim D mentioned he wouldn’t be reading LADR any longer because of this article.
It’s never my intention to “force” my opinion on anyone.That includes whether or not the Dodgers should make a statement about this political situation, or whether I believe a particular trade is good or who should bat lead off. It is my intention, however to provide LADRs readers with insightful food for thought, that is connected to the Dodgers and baseball.
A comment in this thread quoted the article where I stated there are times a writer is compelled to go beyond the boxscore, and asked, “What’s next? Global warming…etc..?” I’ve written alongside Scott for three years, and I’ve written “political” articles perhaps three times, including this one, and I’ve always included how the article is directly related to the Dodgers.
Anyone who is a regular reader here should know by now I don’t write about politics often, or use LADR as a subterfuge to brainwash you all into thinking politically like me. I didn’t trick anyone into reading the article, as the headline and lead photo were clear indications about the content. It was no different than an article with a headline about a trade and a photo showing the traded player. There aren’t going to be any surprises about the content within. Any reader is free to not read that article and read the next one published. Right?
Every writer wants his or her readers to comment on the writing. I knew this article would generate spirited comments and some heat, but no writer appreciates being told to go back to where he came from, in veiled statements or not, whether he was born in America or not.
Scott and I appreciate all of our readers, and those who comment. As Scott said, we encourage healthy debate and freedom of speech.Our site has had an interesting recent couple of months, and we thank those of you who have stuck with us through it all.
If anyone wants to keep the political debate going, I encourage you to keep it all in this thread, and not bleed it into a new article’s comments. Thanks.
Scott,
I didn’t see this before, but when Jim told Oscar, to go back over the border, he lost any respect, and he showed, his true colors.
That is just disrespectful.
As a union member who is old enough to remember the civil rights and war protests I can not help but identify with the women, queer people, minorities, working people, environmentalists, scientists, all protesting the conservative and richest 1% of America’s agenda. The Dodgers of course were the barrier breakers and the rest of MLB followed. It may have been just good business but it was a watershed moment. To ever go back to the way it was is just unthinkable to me. We must have progress on social issues. We must take care of our sick and old. We must not discriminate against any gender of any kind, traditional or alternative. Science is not a liberal conspiracy. One religion is as good as an other, or as bad. We must have an economy that doesn’t favor the richest 1% or 2% and gives all the people a path to prosperity. Get the big money out of politics. Encourage sustainable economic growth not boom then bust. That’s just an other way for the rich to buy low and sell high. Encourage sustainable energies and farming so my grandsons children can have a decent earth to live on. We’ve had constant war since 2001, how about we give peace a chance. Maybe I’m a dreamer but I ain’t the only one. As in baseball every spring… hope springs eternal. And as Forrest said, that’s all I got to say about that.
Oscar, there’s just a lot of anger on both sides. We saw that at Berkeley, and we saw the flip side with the border comment by Jim D. above. I appreciate you wanting to further the dialog and have a discussion, but I wish more people who voice their opinions about politics and our current state would do so in a way that aims to bring people a little closer together from their opposite poles. It’s to the point where we have two sides that are so far apart that they’re almost speaking a different language. We don’t really have a true dialog where two opposing sides actually talk and listen to each other. You’re guilty of it, too, here.
When you start by describing the “blind hatred that supports the Muslim ban” you already delegitimize anyone who has a different perspective or point, even if it’s sensible or grounded in a reasonable proposition (and I should add parenthetically that it’s already been pointed out several times that it is not, in fact, a Muslim ban..Saudi Arabia…Indonesia…Jordon…Egypt…etc.) It is this type of broad characterization to that has shut down real open and honest dialog for years. College campuses today aren’t even bastions of open and higher learning, but have turned into repressive leftist seminaries, where speakers who deviate from doctrine can blocked from speaking through violence and intimidation. And this is justified by appropriating language; everything that is not part of official doctrine is described as “hate speech.” It is this type of polemical manipulation: labeling anything opposing point of view as racist, hate, misogynistic, etc. that people finally repudiated by voting into office a guy who just doesn’t care. At some point, people have to change how they talk to each other.
Nice to see you back Patch
I happen to agree with Jim D for the most part. I do not blindly remove myself from following sports or websites as he has. But there is an old saying, a time and a place. If people want to voice opinions and scream at the wind, this is a free country and I am a believer in the 1st Amendment. But I think Facebook is where he should be posting.
This is not to say I do not agree with some of what Oscar is saying. But I come here for sports and the Dodgers. If I want irrational and opinionated political rants (by the way, these rants come from both parties in equal amounts), I can turn on any channel on TV, or any news website, or Facebook.
Well Scott, I see no reason to be sorry to someone like Jim D that thinks his non-baseball rant is so much more important that he doesn’t limit what he has to say. I don’t like my friends being attacked and the writers here and me go a few years back and it’s easy to see just who is out of bounds and that wasn’t Oscar. You guys say whatever you want….it’s your site and nobody can fire you! Haaaaaaaaaa!
Jim D, I can understand boycotting NFL and NBA over their disrespect of the American flag and all it represents. If MLB or the Dodgers join in, they wouldn’t see any of my dollars either.
But Oscar, born in the shadow of Dodger Stadium (actually as I understand it, he’s an old fart and Dodger Stadium wasn’t even there), is a Merican and entitled to his opinion. Good healthy debate is good. Much better to argue than shoot.
Debate is essential right now, as our duly elected President reestablishes the law. After eight years of many blindly following the globalist Obozo, with his pen and phone creating law like a dictator and celebrated by a Pravda like media, many are sincerely concerned. It’s going to be painful right now for many to see AMERICANS put first, after years of some acting like America belonged to the WORLD. It doesn’t, it belongs to Americans and as it is reestablished that our government is there for the benefit of AMERICANS many are going to be upset.
Fact is, we have millions of non-Americans feeding at the public-teet in America. There just isn’t enough money to support 100 million non-working Americans and millions more non-Americans. There is tough days ahead and there is going to be a lot of pain for a lot of people. It was unavoidable as America’s politicians squandered our national treasure on so many boondoggles. We are $20 trillion in debt with other countries working hard to take away our currencies reserve status, it isn’t going to always be pretty. Join the discussion!!
Hey Oscar,
Congratulations, you stoked the flames of prejudice and hate that Obama so carefully succeeded in bringing back.
Shame on you. It’s time to whip it, whip it good, move ahead… go forward … It’s not too late, to whip it
At least you got a lot of comments
I know I feel really safe. This is about America first.
We’re just not used to it. We’ll adjust nicely though,
You just wait and see
No, I did not read your article. I read the headline
Politics are starting to make me want to vomit.
I am against anyone trying to politicize everything.
Anything and everything. Barf
Of which you just did…(make a political statement).You should have stopped after your first comment. By the way, I don’t feel safe and free. Why? Because I’m more likely to get shot and killed by a fellow American than a foreigner. I’m not getting used to that.
And this is why I just can’t buy argument the left has right now. It is just so ridiculously over the top and histrionic. You sound like all of those college kids who couldn’t go to class because they were “literally” unsafe and in danger and “literally shaking” because Trump is “literally Hitler.” Please….please….if you want to take a position or make an argument, make a rational one.
How about a little truth on this issue. First, Obama did the same thing for 6 months against anyone from Iraq. That was in 2011. There are over 50 predominately Muslim nations in the world and Trump has chosen 7 which all have training bases and HQ’s for ISIS and other terror organizations. Here is the law used by both Presidents to enact their executive orders…notice it says ANY CLASS of aliens.
Title 8 USC § 1182(f) Suspension of entry or imposition of restrictions by President
Whenever the President finds that the entry of any aliens or of any class of aliens into the United States would be detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by proclamation, and for such period as he shall deem necessary, suspend the entry of all aliens or any class of aliens as immigrants or non immigrants, or impose on the entry of aliens any restrictions he may deem to be appropriate.
Whenever the Attorney General finds that a commercial airline has failed to comply with regulations of the Attorney General relating to requirements of airlines for the detection of fraudulent documents used by passengers traveling to the United States (including the training of personnel in such detection), the Attorney General may suspend the entry of some or all aliens transported to the United States by such airline.
Now, why don’t be get back to DODGER BASEBALL as Vinny so eloquently says.
For God’s sake leave politics out of it. We come to this site to enjoy a part of life away from politics but you insist on rubbing our faces in your political opinion because “there come times when a writer is compelled to go above and beyond the boxscore…” When will the next “time” be? Global warming? Abortion? Crime? Education policy? If you want to exhibit your moral superiority go to a political website.
Agree, no place for politics. The ban is temporary. Did you say anything in 2011 when Obama banned all refugees from Iraq for 6 months? It makes me madder than hell when a Democrat President does it and nothing is said. But let a Republican President do it and the press and left wing come unglued.
Idahoal, Please site a reference of Obama banning refugees.
Never mind, I found it.
You’re comparing apples and oranges. Obama ban was based on evidence of a specific terrorist incident and imposed on one country (if I remember right-it may have been two-but it was specific, as I said). Trumps ban is not based on any specific incident or intelligence. Rather, it’s a blanket ban that can be argued to be a religious test – which is specifically barred by the constitution under the Equal Protection Clause.
I also support President Trump’s quick action to stop the flow of people from the same seven countries that Barrack Obama identified as terrorist countries. The four month immigration freeze is a common sense move to protect AMERICAN CITIZENS.
I would like to think that Oscar is just a misinformed individual who gets his “news” from traditional Fake News sites, like CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NBC and ABC. A lot of people fall for the Democrat Slave Party and their media allies propaganda campaigns. Got to realize that the Democrats are in full panic mode. They see Trump’s approval percentages going up and know that a huge majority of Americans appreciate someone finally putting them first. Democrats see the money and their power slipping away.
Yeah, common sense tells us that our country could do a lot more good stopping the numerous middle east wars by setting up and supporting “safe zones” for the people in areas close to their countries. How about setting up these zones in Saudi Arabia? Interesting that the 5 richest Arab countries have refused to take even ONE refugee.
Exciting times we live in, I look forward to Trump working with Putin to end the Syrian, Libyan, Iraq and Afghanistan Wars. Even if Oscar is correct in his thinking that all the refugees are fine people (and I am sure many are) they will be needed in their own countries to rebuild.
Idahoal, you stole some of my thunder on Obama’s six-month Iraq ban. Maybe Oscar can share with us what actions he took THEN to fight the “discrimination and hate”.
Here is a timely and relevant article: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2017/01/trumps_orders_on_immigrants_brings_hypocritical_and_hysterical_uproar.html
Right on brother…….
Wait. ABC, NBC, MSBC, CNN and CBS are all fake news?
What is “real news”?
Trump’s approval ratings are dreadful, unless I’m reading fake news.
RealClear has:
President Trump Job Approval
Approve 43.5
Disapprove 45.0
Disapprove +1.5
Congressional Job Approval
Approve 18.5
Disapprove 69.4
Disapprove +50.9
Trump Favorability Ratings
Favorable42.0
Unfavorable49.6
Unfavorable +7.6
What is “real news”? Well let’s start with news organization’s that don’t collude with democrats. I guess where you get your news didn’t report the Wikileaks news. Here is a few examples:
http://thefreethoughtproject.com/wikileaks-10-most-damning-clinton-emails-media/
As far as polling, I’m surprised you didn’t list $.0538. At least start with some polling organizations that had a CLUE about the last election!
No, I’m serious. Where can you find “real news”. I’m down with you not liking 538, but I like them and think they actually had a “clue” with regard the election.
Wait, why do you call 538 $.0538? The name has nothing to do with money.
Please, I’d like to know. Where do you think you can find “real news”?
Bluto
Anyone that supports Trump, doesn’t want the truth!
That is obvious, because he is an complusive liar!
Bluto, first, regarding 538, I think somebody, on the board, referred to their predictions as “money”. I like to show what I think their predictions are worth in dollar terms. Did they have a clue about the election? I thought they said C.H.C. had about a 90%+ chance of winning, that Trump had no credible path to 270 electoral votes.
Real News? I start with Drudge, go there several times a day. Really they are just a compilation of multiple news sources. “American Thinker” publishes multiple essays daily on pertinent topics, you got any arguments with the two I posted today? I do go to Breitbart and I like “Zero Hedge” and of course, I am exposed to the Fake News entities listed above. I find what I call “Fake News” always reports in “lock step” with each other. Makes sense because most of the “main stream media in controlled by about 6 huge corporations, with large foreign ownership. They have pretty much been a monopoly, hopefully no more!
I think the future in media, is lots of bloggers, the more info the better. I love what Trump has done to the Washington Press Corps. First, thought about moving to the old executive office building and adding many more reporters. Washington Press Corp freaked out. Now they have added 4 “blogger chairs” giving access to other news sources (via face time) not previously represented in the Washington Press Corp. Trump’s guy Sean Spicer ?, really freaked them out by starting and ending one of his press conferences by letting these other news organization ask questions. Monopolies never want to cede power. Does it bother you to see the fake news organizations I listed colluding with Democrats?
Bottom line to me, based on my life experiences, I know white people are no more racist/prejudiced than any other ethnic group, we are ALL equally flawed! When I read, the same old tired “racist” attack by democrats (the slave party), I at least got to investigate and find a news organization that will “clearly” state the reason for the new policy, and accurately report what the policy makers are saying. After doing that, a better decision can be made about the Real News.
Do you really believe when Obama suspended Iraqi immigration for six months that wasn’t racist but Trump’s suspension is? Or does it just fit a “political agenda”?
Hey Boxout,
Thanks for that.
Didn’t know that about 538, full disclosure they are a little too esoteric for me. They did, I guess, come the closest with regard to the election.
Most of your publications are a little too right for me. Especially American Thinker and Breitbart. They provide me little more insight than DailyKos or TheNation, and those dunderheads.
Drudge doesn’t really have any news, he just has links or has that changed? If just links, and if you care what I like, I prefer RealClearPolitics, which gives a much broader spectrum.
What about the Washington Post? Do you read Robert Costa there?
Bluto, I recognize and appreciate that you are fundamentally rational and want to gather objective information that is closer to reality to form your own opinion. To your question where you can find “real news,” I really don’t have a solid answer. I think everything we see and hear has been compromised. It has been a slow process over the years, but with this last year and the insane level of polarization, even the bastions in news such as the NYT no longer have much of a veneer of objectivity. The NYT is still a good paper, but when headline there describes Trump as a liar, it’s a crossed Rubicon of partisanship that maybe can’t be undone and is unprecedented.
I read the Wall Street Journal if I want to get some objective grounding. I think the front page gives a pretty objective assessment of the current events that are important. It is substantive, and is still separate in tone from the opinion pages there, which tends to lean a little to the right, but are more policy driven. If you recognize that, it’s still useful because you at least come away informed about broader economic and public policy issues.
I hear what you’re saying Box, about the democratization of how we get our news now more broadly spread to individual sources and blogs, and this is in theory a good thing. The problem I have is that it just allows people to find their own individual echo chambers. We just becomes consumers of whatever reality we want to identify with, and are never challenged with opposing and rational viewpoints or evidence. There was a time where editors of the major newspapers and news outlets took their journalistic credibility seriously. Back then you could compare the role of the journalist to that of a judge; they took their impartiality and search for the truth seriously. Now everyone is just an advocate. At what point does Fox morph into Breitbart, which then morphs into Alex Jones?
Boxout
That doesn’t work with people that are smart enough to know, that that is just a smoke screen, to avoid the truth.
And Trump doesn’t even know how to tell the truth, let alone, care about ethics, or the truth.
This guy is a complusive liar!
Hey MJ…
Barf
Boxout
What did I tell you about that democratic slave party that you always spot out about.
They joined the Repubilcan party, in the year Nixon was elected!
Look it up!
Hey MJ…
Barf
The uproar over this is comical because Obama did basically the same thing a few years ago, only it was just Iraq. The seven countries banned, and it is a 3 month moratorium until they are fully vetted, are all filled with Islamic fanatics. I think the uproar is more about Trump and not about freedom. Certainly we welcome those that come to get away from oppression. But obey our laws and do not try and push your religion on us as we will not to the same to you. Trump is just doing what he said he would do. I do not want un-vetted refugee’s who could be terrorist’s in my country. And only a handful of people were stopped from entering the US. It is not like every Muslim who stepped off the plane was detained…………and that’s the end of that subject…..Go Dodgers! 16 days til spring!!!
Michael,
Does this mean all evangelicals should be barred from entry “do not try and push your religion (fixed the spelling) on us”? That would be a definite new step in our immigration policy.
If it’s only applied to Muslims, then it’s a religious test and that’s unconstitutional last time I read Article VI of the Constitution.
This one hits home close to me, because I’m Jewish.
Bluto: Last time I checked there were no radical evangelicals trying to blow things up. Neither have I seen them going around causing revolutions. And as for it not being constitutional, they are not US citizens and therefore have NO RIGHTS under the constitution. You go to any country on a visa and they can ship your ass right back home if you have something in your back ground that they do not like. Yes, a few people got caught up in the net who probably should not have. But it is about PROTECTING US CITIZENS from terrorists. It is not about religion. And like I said, if they are vetted properly, I have no problem with them coming here.
First of all Michael,
The issue is people not citizens, like the equal protection clause of the constitution:
“states shall not…deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.”
Any person, not any citizen.
But there’s your greater point about a threat to safety. We can all see that. But it makes me wonder, are you more worried about a person’s intent or his religion? I would gather the intent.
But, I’m trying to figure it out.
Bluto
Why don’t you tell these people about the boat of Jews, that were not allowed to come into the US, during World War Two.
That were sent back to there country, to there deaths.
I’m fine. Just needed a break from the flames of hatred.
Good on ya Oscar for addressing the topic. We have a divided nation. It isn’t that difficult to see where the loyalty falls is it. It’s manifested in tone and temperament.
I hope for the worlds sake those who seek peaceful resolutions prevail.
As for the Dodgers, they’re still my team though I’m not as invested in the FAZ model as some. For the record I think what they’ve done is genius. They have won two more division titles, leading MLB in attendance and tv revenue and did so while losing more games each year. They have succeeded in keeping interest up while convincing with smoke and mirrors they are reducing payroll (they really didn’t) and building the system (that was already built). The real trick will be can they continue the ‘now you see me’ act with high risk 30+ additions at the same time the players THEY drafted finally arrive.
Is ’17 the year the drought is broken? Yeah, sure. Believe it. They’re counting on it.
As for Timmons, I know him too well to ever want to engage him again. He revealed himself here, and people made a choice to follow him. They can have him. Like minds I assume. Most of the posters I’ve known from the past, guys that I’ve actually met and whose company I thoroughly enjoy, are still in touch. A few, like Roger, have moved on.
I’ll check in on occasion. Good luck to all. We’re going to need it
Glad to hear you are fine!!
Yeah, you did need a break from the flames of hatred. It was easy for many of us to see, that the nuclear explosion level of “Timmons hatred” burning inside you, would consume you. It was a textbook example of hatred “manifested in tone and temperament”.
Good luck, seek help!
No kidding..
The most over rated FO in the game today. Ironically, ownership continues to hire folks to fill in the weaknesses that Friedman & Zaidi both possess. It’s really quite comical.
Badger
Good to hear from you.
I hope you are doing ok.
Damn, if great minds don’t think alike!!!
Another timely article. President Trump is a F ing genius. You tell them Saudis Mr. President!!!
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2017/01/saudi_king_agrees_to_support_and_finance_safe_zones_for_refugees_in_syria_and_yemen.html
WINNING!!
Well it’s a little difficult to demand the King of Saudi Arabia do anything after you’ve bowed to him. That first meeting/year set the tone as to the pecking order. Obama placed the US below Saudi Arabia. Let’s see what happens now that Trump is in office. $1,000 says them Saudi’s start jumping now.
Chili
Who was in office when 911 happened?
Did they go after Saudia Arabia when that happened?
Isn’t that is where most of the terrorists were from?
No they went into Iraq, instead of dealing, with Saudia Arabia.
That was before Obama became president.
My comment has nothing to do with 911.
My comment HAS EVERYTHING TO DO WITH OUR CURRENT SITUATION. It’s called ISIS and the fact that this group formed and became bold and ‘powerful’ while our last President did very little. In fact he called them nothing more than a JV team and proceeded to bomb them for 4 years not deterring them from taking large swath of land and killing thousands of people while raping women all along the way. BECAUSE Saudi Arabia did not respect our last President, they DID NOTHINIG to help the situation in Syria & Iraq. Saudi Arabia has not taken in 1 refugee. Even they know how crazy these people are and yet our last ‘traitor in Chief’ was willing to bring them here by the thousands. Please tell me why other Muslim countries a few hundred miles away would not accept these ‘peaceful, loving’ people? In addition our last ‘traitor in Chief’ could not even get Saudi Arabia to spend a single dollar to create safe zones in the region which is much cheaper and safer than hundreds of thousand refugees treking throughout Europe and beyond. TRUMP has been in office for one week and the Saudi’s are willing to provide monies to create safety zones.
So I have 2 questions for you MJ.
1.) Why couldn’t the ‘great’ Obama cut a deal with Saudi Arabia for helping to finance safe zones?
2.) Why would 5 of the wealthiest countries (Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, Kuwait & Bahrain) in the Middle East not be willing to take in a single ‘peaceful, loving’ refugee from Syria or Iraq?
This is the subject at hand, hence the Immigration issues/policy already on the books that our new ‘Commander in Chief’ is enforcing.
Chili
Saudia Arabia, doesn’t want to be banned, from the US.
That sounds like a bribe to Trump, to not get banned.
And Trump happens to have a hotel in Saudia Arabia, and that is a conflict in interest, and that is a big problem.
And I bet those countries are afraid of getting attacked from Iyis too.
Hey MJ….
Pull my finger
Safe Zones have been part of two Syrian strategies that I’ve thought the US should explore.
The other being the cratering of Syrian military runways.
The problem with the safe zones, as I understand it, is that you need troops to keep them safe. A little uneasy about sending troops to Syria, even in a peacekeeping role.
I understand that the cratering of the runways wouldn’t STOP the atrocities, but at least they’d slow them.
Bluto, safe zones should have been set up in surrounding countries a long time ago. I hear over 600,000 people have died in Syria. Turkey has over a 1,000,000 refugees, much more cost effective and helps MORE people to have supported them financially.
Cratering Syrian military runways? Haven’t we bombed enough of the world? I don’t necessarily believe Assad is the worst player in Syria. Hard to tell who really is the bad guys. Not sure why Obama, the first eight year president to be at war the WHOLE time, felt he needed to destabilize Syria.
I expect a STOP to the atrocities soon. Let’s team up with Russia, wipe out ISIS in Syria and bring the people back under Assad. Most of the fighting is already stopping, Aleppo, fighting is pretty much over. Bring the people back to rebuild. Let Russia supply the manpower to provide safety. We have screwed up enough in the world, let them try.
Assad is among the worst leaders in the World. The people won’t come back, and if they do he’ll probably massacre them in due time.
You know how i just said Assad is amongst the worst in the world? I agree he may not be the worst in Syria. That’s why I’m almost as worried as who replaces ISIS as I am with ISIS.
Not sure why you draw a line at bombing, but not at your proposal in supporting Russia (another horrific regime) and they do the bombing?
Why do I “support” Russia doing the bombing? I guess because the U.S. has been wrong so much. Look at the arguments on this board. Many blame Bush, others Clinton and Obama. Probably some truth to everyone’s argument.
The bombing by Russia is bringing a quick end to the carnage. If we quit arming the opposition the fighting will stop. Going forward, if the region isn’t engulfed in war and Assad starts “massacring” his people they can flee to neighboring safe zones. Just like I don’t think all white people are racists, all Muslims terrorists, I don’t think all Russians have bad intentions. Just like Trump said, “wouldn’t it be great if Russia and the U.S. could work together”.
Syria is a Russian client state, we have many more. Let them solve the carnage in Syria and replace ISIS in Syria. I just don’t see much Russian genocide in this world. Kind of cracked me up, when I heard some politicians accusing Russia of “war crimes” in Syria, like only American bombs are good bombs. Russia in Syria will be OK, client states aren’t all they are cranked up to be”.
Hey,
Thanks for the reply.
Not trying to be a prick, but can you explain a little further on this:
Why do I “support” Russia doing the bombing? I guess because the U.S. has been wrong so much.
I just have a hard time figuring out what one has to do with the other.
You haven’t seen much Russian Genocide? Um, Georgia? Chechnya?
How about Putin’s killing reporters? Or political opponents, obviously not genocide, but not much higher on the morality scale. Right?
As to the idea of client states, that’s pretty sound. However, the issue is that we’re dealing with a region:
1. Where borders and boundries are being obliterated and ignored
2. Where problems quickly extend beyond the edges of the client state.
You could obviously blame all this on the invasion of Iraq and the disaster in Libya. Where outside forces -> (led to) disruption -> chaos -> horrors.
But first of all, that implies that if neither event happens then things would be fine. But they weren’t! Many of these states were harboring chaos and horrors before the Iraq War. Is your idea, because I am generalizing, that if we let things lie they’ll be fine.
Look at how ridiculous the sheep are behaving.
Soros is having a blast. Baaaaaa Baaaaaa
When are we going to extridite him?
I don’t think Boxout is a sheep, he sounds reasonable for the most part.
Wait. Who is a sheep? What does that imply?
Oscar, Bluto, Badger,
Good Job!!!!
This ban was not based on making America safe!
There has not been a single terrorist come from any of the country’s, that have been banned, that has made an attack on America, since 1974.
Once again, they are targeting the wrong countries, like they did, after 911, when went in and started a war in Iraq.
There were more terrorists come from Saudi Arabia, then any other country, in the attack of 911.
Trump is purposely, not banning any country, that he has businesses in, or does business with, even though those are the countries, that most of the terrorists, have been from!
Wake up!
Check again MJ… the shooters in the Christmas massacre in San Bernardino were from Syria. They also traveled to countries prior to the attack that are full of hate for the US….It is about protecting the US. And I care not what the media says because those morons only want a story and not what is really happening. I see nothing hate based on our side, I see someone trying to secure a border that has been breeched too many times………
Michael
You better check.
That attack was from an American man, born in Illinois, and the lady he married and brought over to our country, on a 90 day finance pass, was born in Pakistan, and was living in Saudia Arabia.
No, if I remember correctly the female had “extreme” leanings before she got her Visa. Don’t think the man did.
MJ, you haven’t use to alternative facts yet, have you?
I like the Muslim ban because it prevents Muslims from coming here and terrorizing us.
Next, we should ban white Christians from movie theaters, because then nobody will ever get shot while watching a movie. oh, and ban white christians from schools, because they’re the only ones who go to schools and shoot kids. Oh, and bar white christians from entering black churches or sikh temples, because only white people go in there and start killing folks in the name of white power.
I like all of these ideas!!
Bluto
She probably did, but it wasn’t just her, who made the attack.
And this American was obviously leaning that way before he met her, and he was in on the attack.
How do you think he got in touch with this women, in the first place?
He only was able to spend 90 days with her, before he married her.
I don’t think she convinced him, in 90 days.
Bobby, in the words of “Del Gue” in the movie Jeremiah Johnson, “Tweren’t Mormons”!
Just like President Trump only restricted people from 7 Muslim countries and doesn’t do anything about the other 50 Muslim States, you need to target the worst offenders.
Do a little investigation, none of the mass murderers you make reference to were practicing Christians! NO, a much better ban would be to ban guns from Democrats. Pretty much ALL of the mass murderers have been Democrats. Added benefit is most Democrats favor gun control and should gladly hand over their guns.
Hp Wolfe
No in my family, an alternative fact, is a lie.
Good for you Oscar! It’s difficult to write about what others feel should be the norm. Don’t let these ‘Mericans silence you. There is nothing worse than a blind man that does not want to see, but if they are ok with a Natzi sympathizer being lead council to the most powerful man in the world and demonstrate zero tolerance for life well, what can you do. Yes Obama did the same thing in Iraq; however, what is interesting to me is that Obama did not have personal interests in Iraq like Trump does in the countries that will not be vetted. I love the spin of “We are following through with what the Obama administration came up with.” Really? How convenient to now start following through with policies of the former administration. Those were starting points for conversation. The Right’s president will be impeached. It’s funny how he mentioned that Christians were being murdered in these countries which led me to this:
Exodus 23:9
“You shall not oppress a stranger, since you yourselves know the feelings of a stranger, for you also were strangers in the land of Egypt.
Good to see you enter the fray Gonzo!
Damn, I thought Oscar was a “Merican”? If he isn’t, what is he?
American
Really?
First of all Trump will not be impeached. Nice thought though. If anyone should have been impeached it was the traitor Obama.
Over the past 28 years this country has been led by a Bush, Clinton or Obama. 28 years of some of the worse leadership this country has ever experienced. All are part of the establishment that doesn’t want to lose its’ power over the people.
And quoting Exodus…..didn’t know Americans were enslaved in a foreign land these past 240 years and now seeking their promised land. Rather than take one verse out of context as God was leading his people out of 400 years of bondage, how about quoting all of the scriptures in the Bible where God advises Israel to defend themselves and the land He promised them. The fact that those which attempted to enter the Nation of Israel illegally or to overtake it have been killed, destroyed and slaughtered for generations doesn’t quite fit your narrative, does it?
Walls have been built for centuries to keep foreigners out of cities and countries alike.
Here’s some real hypocrisy. The Pope. Pope Francis urged Catholic bishops in the United States to open their doors to immigrants, asserting that “these people will enrich America and its Church.”
“Perhaps you will be challenged by their diversity,” he said. “But know that they also possess resources meant to be shared. So do not be afraid to welcome them.”
This is coming from a man who lives in a city-state completely surrounded, literally, by giant walls. Vatican City is a literal fortress. Pope Francis could order such a thing tomorrow, and after the walls came down he could also choose to greet the wave of “pilgrims” with the “warmth of the love of Christ.”
Of course Pope Francis would never do such a thing because he knows what would happen: Vatican City would be no more, everyone’s security and well-being would be compromised, and the standard of living for close to a thousand residents would be destroyed. Chaos would completely destroy the home of St. Peter.
Please tell me what has been happening in our country over the past 30 years.
We all have different views. What makes sense to me may not necessarily make sense to you. That does not mean that you are wrong and I am right. The president is doing what he believes is best for the country, just like Obama did. They are total opposites. Obama catered to the Muslim world and molly coddled Iran who is one of our worst enemies. I have no problem with a president who puts our safety and well being first. That is my opinion. I do not expect everyone to agree. I do not view what he is doing as hatred. I view it as being careful…..something this nation has forgotten how to do.
Michael
Iran is helping us, fight the terrorists.
It isn’t like it use to be with them.
Wrong MJ…Iraq is providing troops not Iran. The nuclear treaty with them is one of the MOST DANGEROUS pacts ever signed because we still do not get to inspect their sites. And it is like it has always been. The country is run by a Islamic fundamentalist government that still blames the US for the Shah. They still are a HUGE threat to Israel who has been one of our staunchest allies for years and Obama stabbed those guys in the back just before he left office. Look, I do not care what religion you are. Terrorism from any religion is wrong. Trouble is this, you cannot just look at someone immigrating to this country and say, they are not terrorists. Or fanatics. That takes back ground checks and some time. Hell I go buy a gun and I get checked and rechecked from here to next week and I was born here and served my country. You telling me that someone who is NOT A CITIZEN of this country should just be able to walk through the door???? No thanks. What ever precautions they take are OK in my book. We just see things differently. I knew some would jump all over my post and that is ok. I believe what I believe and no one is going to change that……..I am not anti Islam, I am not against anyone who wants to LEGALLY enter the US. But if you have an agenda against my country, I am against you…..
Michael
I never said that they had troops in this.
But they are against Iyis, like we are.
If you want to worry about our enemys, you better check into Russia, who hasn’t went on record against Iyis, like Iran has.
And our president is thinking about easing the sanctions, against Russia.
And if anyone is our enemy, it is Russia.
This is the one thing that Trump didn’t steal from Reagans campaign, because Reagan, was not in bed with Russia.
Michael,
Vey well stated.
Many forget Obama being ‘caught’ whispering to Putin about waiting until after he got re-elected. The lying, crooked media never did follow up on that. There we had a recording of something ‘real’ between our sitting President and Vladmir Putin and nothing was uncovered. All of the hacking done by the Russian (and others) were done so on Obama’s watch. Again, he did nothing!
Oh wait. He did say this.
“I felt that the most effective way to ensure that it did not happen [again] was to talk to him directly and tell him to cut it out, there were going to be some serious consequences if he did not,” Obama said of Putin. He said after he spoke with the Russian leader, U.S. officials stopped seeing evidence of tampering.
So per our ‘traitor in chief’ the hacking stopped back in September. 2 months before the election.
Chili
The media is just reporting Trumps lies.
He still insists, that there were three million ilegal voters, in this last presidential election.
And that is only in Trump’s little mind.
Because the truth is, that Trump lost the popular vote, by almost three million votes.
He lies about anything, to try to make himself, look better.
Try denying that!
Trump is feeding in, to what Isys wants.
He is going to get us into a war.
But isn’t that the way republicans, get jobs for us?
Bluto
LA Times A Year after San Bernardino Terror Attack, the FBI is Still Struggling to Answer Key Questions.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/09/us/san-bernardino-shooting/
In specific:
If Malik had already radicalized years ago, how did she get the go-ahead to immigrate to the United States in 2014?
A senior State Department official told CNN on Wednesday that Malik was not asked about jihadist leanings when a U.S. consular official interviewed her in Pakistan for her fiancee visa application last year. That’s because no red flags were found in the Department of Homeland Security application that was submitted and checked before the interview, the official said.
Bluto
I was answering Michael, because he said that both of these terrorists, were from Syria.
I told him, that one was born in Illinoise, and the other one, was born in Pakistan.
And I said , she was living in Saudia Arabia.
And that is the truth.
And they both were in on the attack.
And both went to Syria and were radicalized there. There are a lot of people who have left the US, became a Muslim and have become radicalized. Where they were born has nothing to do with it. Where they go to get all this hatred against the US does.
Again you are wrong MJ because we are already in a war and Trump did not start it. Osama Bin Laden started it in 2001. We are retaliating to what happened to us. Maybe we have not gone about it the right way, but neither Bush nor Obummer were able to stop it. And another thing, the other side does not play by the rules, but everyone expects the US to obey the rules. Horse manure, you cheat to win a war, I am damn well going to retaliate in kind. They started it, it is about time someone stopped it.
Michael
The problem is non of these countries, have had people come over here, and attack the us.
Those people did not go to Syria, or come from Syria.
She was in Saudia Arabia, went he went to visit her.
And like I said, he was American citizen, and she was born in Pakistan.
There is not a thing to do with Syria.
Michael
Bush sure didn’t handle this correctly, and he is the one, who put are troops on ground, in Iraq.
He also made our economy hit the skids.
And you have a problem with Obama, but not the guy that got us in this ground war, in a country that had no terrorists, in the attack on 911.
Why did Bush not go after the true terrorists, of 911?
They were mostly from Saudia Arabia, and Bush went into Iraq.
Michael
You made my point, where was Osama Bin Laden from?
Saudia Arabia, and where did Bush put troops on the ground at? Iraq.
Well he is inheriting a mess from the Obama Administration. Let’s see. Russia has been taking land at will and causing havoc wherever they can.
Do you approve them taking land from the Ukraine? Do you approve them helping Assad in Syria?
Obama did nothing.
The Chinese are building islands in International waters. Do you support them having the ability to shut down 30% of all trade if they so choose?
Obama did nothing.
Iran now has access to billions of dollars and is working with Russia to develop nuclear weapon capabilities. They also held American sailors hostage and took incriminating pictures of them for posterity. Were you good with that?
What did Obama do? Yep, you got it…..NOTHING.
THIS is the best point of criticism for Obama and his eight years. There was no consistency and no real dogma in Foreign Policy.
Honestly, it was confounding, frustrating and ridiculous.
Chili
I don’t aprove of what Russia is doing, but I don’t want to see our young people go to war on the ground, in the Middle East, or anywhere else, if they don’t have to.
Yeah, comment on only one of the statements. So you don’t have a problem with what Iran did and what the Chinese are doing?
Yep, you are a lot like Obama….afraid to stand up to anyone. He was too. You nor he are emotionally qualified to be a US President.
Thats why the world is a mess. NO STRONG LEADERSHIP!
Chili
Trump has done nothing yet.
And we will see, what happens.
At least you’re talking about something. I agree with some of it, disagree with others, and I certainly have nothing to say to add to the discussion. There’s comfort in the fact that most, especially Boxout, are playing their usual rolls. But we are missing Badger, Mark too for that matter.
Jonah
What were you saying last night?
I told you, not to worry about it.
And look what happened today.
Wondering
Just like we were saying last night!
Come on! Do you guys really believe that a ban on immigration, even temporary, is the way to make us safe? At what price? You have taken a big sip out of the Kool Aid jar. You might FEEL safe, but that’s about it. For me, my take is Bin Laden has won HIS war. More restrictions; less freedoms; more anger and hatred.
As our Idiot in Chief would say: “He won.” The people who support this guy should have been born about 100 years ago. You would have fit right in. And you have 2 World Wars to look forward to.
Bobbie 17
Like I already said, there has not been an single terrorists attack, from anyone, coming from all of the countries, that Trump has banned.
And he didn’t ban the countries that he has a business in, or does business with, even though most of the terrorists, have came from those countries.
This is just like what happened in 911, when Bush went into Iraq, even though most of those terrorists, were from Saudia Arabia, where Trump has a hotel at.
How many have been stopped by law enforcement because those people were either given up or found in searches of terrorist organization roles? If you really believe there are no terrorist sympathizers or terrorists them selves in this country right now not making plans to do something, you are either very naïve or blind.
Michael
No one is saying that.
But why did he ban those countries, that no terrorist has come from?
And why didn’t he ban the countries he has businesses in, or does business with?
Michael
And you know there have been Americans, that have become radicalized, over the internet, who have made attacks, on the US too.
The countries that were banned are the ones that most of the problems have come from. Yemen has long been a haven for those from Hamas and Al Qaeda, Syria is also on that list, and Iran is there for all the obvious reasons. 7 countries, no big deal. I think all of you are wearing blinders and just do not like Trump. If he shut off immigration from Mexico, most would applaud it, except those of Mexican decent, they would go ballistic. You feel safe? You shouldn’t. The police are over stretched as it is. But there is nothing anyone can argue that will make me change my thinking and my thinking is American’s first. The rest can wait their turn. When people get all worked up that someone is trying to protect our borders, yet remain blind to homeless veterans and people born here who need help, I just do not care.
No one is arguing that Michael.
That’s not the argument. Those who are planning terror, are going to easily find ways around this policy. Once you publicize your defense, it’s able to be gamed.
I would propose that the real momentum behind this action is that the Trump organization wants to limit immigration. Both from Mexico and, frankly, from everywhere. This limits the labor pool and puts upwards pressure, in theory, on wages.
Bluto
Good answer, but you are giving him, way to much credit!
Here is another one for you.
Why does Trump continue to insist, that there were three million ilegals, that voted fraudulent, in this last presidential election?
Do you think maybe it is because, he lost the popular vote, by almost three million votes?
And I loved when you said, in theory.
I guess Trump is a terrorist sympathizer too, because he didn’t ban Saudia Arabia, in fact he atcually has a hotel in Saudia Arabia, and that is where most of the terrorists, from 911, came from.
Trump has a hotel in Saudi Arabia? Now he’s got problems. Just got Saudi Arabia to step up and pay for refugee safe areas. I bet Saudi Arabia is pissed. Payback is going to be a MF.
Boxout
That is just a bribe, to keep that country off the banned list.
And that is where he has a hotel at, and that is a conflict in interest, and that is a problem.
A bribe? I said it once and I will be saying it a lot more, “Trump is a F ing genius”.
Finally, America is WINNING!! Now get a few more rich Arab countries to bribe us by paying for the reconstruction of Syria, Libya, Egypt, Iraq, Afghanistan and taking all the refugees back to THEIR countries. We’re $20 trillion in debt, we NEED some more bribes.
http://www.sessions.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/2015/9/more-than-90-of-recent-middle-eastern-refugees-on-food-stamps-almost-70-on-cash-welfare
Let’s take care of our OWN people!
A bribe? I said it once and I will be saying it a lot more, “Trump is a F ing genius”.
Finally, America is WINNING!! Now get a few more rich Arab countries to bribe us by paying for the reconstruction of Syria, Libya, Egypt, Iraq, Afghanistan and taking all the refugees back to THEIR countries. We’re $20 trillion in debt, we NEED some more bribes.
http://investmentwatchblog.com/usa-muslim-refugees-91-4-on-food-stamps-68-3-on-cash-welfare-they-have-to-go-back/
Obama did not put a hold on refugees from Iraq. He slowed the process down so checks could be made based on a specific threat and to one country. Trumps ban affects all refugees as well as green card holders. To compare the two as Trunp has don’t is just more dealings with alternative facts; and let’s call it for what really is; lies.
One of the first people affected by the ban was an Iraqi who supported our troops fighting Isis. Explain how this is making us safer?
‘One of the first people affected by the ban was an Iraqi who supported our troops fighting Isis.’
How many things are wrong with this statement? You know what I BET HE WAS ALL FOR OUR TROOPS FIGHTING ISIS IN THE MIDDLE EAST. Better our sons and daughters than the Iraqi people fighting for their land against their Muslim brothers. Maybe he now will be forced to stay in HIS country and fight for HIS country.
THIS STATEMENT IS EXACTLY WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS WHOLE SITUATION PERTAINING TO ISIS!
Chili
Sorry but Trump is going to get us in a ground war, in the Middle East, just like Bush did, in Iraq.
And about Russia, just follow the money of Tillerson, and Trump in Russia.
That is the truth!
Nothing like a free ‘get out of jail’ card. ‘America, Merica……family, pack all your belongings. We have the opportunity in a lifetime to go to Merica for free. We are so thankful for Merica Pres’dent Obama and for ISIS. Without either of these 2, we would never have had this once in a lifetime opportunity. It’s so good. Everyone pack your bags…..off to Merica we go. Thank you ISIS. Thank you Obama.’
What in the world does this mean?
Can someone translate it for me?
Bluto
That is Chili’s broken English.
We better report this.
Chili
Make up your mind!
First you complain that Obama didn’t do enough in the Middle East, and now you are wanting the people in the Middle East, to fight there own war.
Who invaded Iraq?
Sorry that went over your heads. Points out the hypocrisy that is being played out.
Chili
I just can’t see that Trump is trying to protect us, when he didn’t put a ban, on the countries, that he has a business in, or does business with.
And it is really true , there hasn’t been a terrorist, come from any of these countries. he has just banned.
And you are right, I don’t have what it takes to be the president.
But I do respect you, and I don’t mean anything personal.
And like I said, we will see.
Us troops were advising Iraqi troops. To do so we need information. He provided that information so that our troops could properly direct the Iraqis. To that job he was already vetted. For putting his life on the line we turned our back. Good luck in getting other foreign nationals to help us if this is how we treat them.
You go Gracie!
All of Trumps supporters, are now taking from Trump’s alternative facts, and making up stories, about Obama!
I don’t see what the problem is. We had to reset this out of control immigration process sooner or later.
The sooner the better. Great job our new president is doing. Hell of a mess he has to clean up
I’d venture to say that not everyone thinks the immigration process is out of control, in any way, shape or form.
But obviously you do.
Immigration and illegal aliens are out of control. They are one and the same thing. We have more illegals here than can be handled and as far as allowing refugees here without PROPER VETTING< I am against it. Take care of our citizens first………..
Bluto
Why don’t you tell them about the boat load of Jewish people, that were not allowed to come into the US, and were sent back to there own country, to there deaths, during World War Two.
Since 538 was brought up:
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/immigrants-are-keeping-america-young-and-the-economy-growing/
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-consequences-a-look-behind-the-claims-on-immigration/
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/there-arent-2-to-3-million-undocumented-immigrants-with-criminal-records-for-trump-to-deport/
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-undocumented-immigrant-workforce-isnt-growing
Artieboy
Just know, that most Americans, don’t feel that way.
Melton
You do know that only citizens of the US, can get those things.
Illegals, don’t get those services, but there childeren that are born here, are the ones, that can get those services.
And that is because when you are born in the US, you become a citizen, of the US.
And I’d venture to say that everyone of us, even Melton, had ancestors who came here from someplace else. Maybe we should have started these exclusions prior to 1620. My hats off to all you people who think you have the right answer, I just don’t know…
Michael
You lived in California, do you think a wall is going to stop people, from coming into the US, from Mexico?
Frias to Indians for cash……no big deal
Wondering
How about the people who came over on that land bridge, before the continental drift?
They are now called “Native Americans”. We’ll give them a pass. I had relatives in that group.
Jonah so do I.
Carlos Frias was sent to the Indians for cash and a bucket of balls.
It’s baseball news on a baseball blog. How interesting
Slotim
It is right around the corner!
Don’t be a stranger.
Bluto, you aren’t being a prick! I enjoy a good debate. It’s even possible to learn something from them!
My statement: “Why do I “support” Russia doing the bombing? I guess because the U.S. has been wrong so much”.
And your statement, I just have a hard time figuring out what one has to do with the other.
Perhaps, I was inarticulate; I was merely trying to express my frustration with ANOTHER long war and involvement by the U.S. in the middle east. We have enough problems right here at home, no need to get so involved, expending blood and treasure, in the middle east. I have NO illusions that the middle east “would be fine” if Iraq or Libya hadn’t happened. Probably the middle east has been in chaos since THEY invented the Shia and Sunni sects.
Regarding Russia, a SUPER POWER, they have a long complicated history. Important to me, is that they allowed the old Soviet Union to break-up without a bullet being fired. I just don’t think that they are an “evil empire” any longer. They ARE sensitive about border security. Perhaps if we in the U.S. had seen our country invaded with 20 million war dead, like them in WW II, we could understand them better. George H. W. Bush promised Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev that the United States would not take advantage of the dismemberment of the Soviet Union to draw former Warsaw Pact nations into the NATO alliance. We broke that promise.
Following is a link to a “Huffington Puffington Post” article that I largely agree with. I am hopeful a new positive relationship can be formed with Russia.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-paul/russia-georgia-war-in-200_b_4891391.html
I had to read that quickly (I’m at work) and I think I agree with it. But we do have ways of countering Russia (as the article notes, they are hostile presences in Ukraine and Georgia.) Economic means, and political means. Sanctions and isolationism respectively.
When you said that the breakup of the USSR happened without firing a bullet. That’s right, but the reclaiming of Crimea didn’t? And lots of bullets and poisons have been used in the repression of the Russian Media and silencing of political opposition parties. Not to mention the creation of an actual oligarchy and kleptocracy.
I can see what you are saying. That allying with Russia is a means to an end, that end being limiting or even eradicating ISIS.
My counter to that would be, what’s the cost? You empower a corrupt administration, we turn a blind-eye to their attempt to reannex territories, and we won’t have any plan for whatever replaces ISIS (I echo and agree with your implication that the whole problem with the Middle East isn’t Israel-Palestine/ISIS or Al Queda. The original sin there is the Sunni-Shia rift.)
Finally, there’s morality (which is subjective). Putin kills his opponents, he enriches his friends, he deals with Iran liberally, he endorses Assad. These are not, in any way, actions to be commended, even if that commendation comes in the form of helping vanquish ISIS. There are moral rights and moral wrongs. It’s good to be on the right side of history.
Boxout
Stop putting out, alternative news, which is fake news.
That is the problem here.
I guess I am not suprised, by some, that don’t care if Trump continues to lie.
Bluto
Check out Investment Watch, this is another news source, that Boxout try’s to use, to back what he says.
It is a fake news source.
MJ, don’t you trust CatBox?
MJ
Just keep watching the few channels you watch. When it comes to politics I know
to not bother reading your posts, they’re just too repetitive and narrow minded.
I’m not saying you’re evil or anything like that, but you sure are brainwashed.
I’m only referring to politics. Nothing personal.
Melton
I am not surprised by your response.
And you are the one who brought up brained wash, is that a self analysis?
And I don’t care if you read my posts, because you are so narrowminded and judgmental, about people not like you .
And there is a word for that, and many think that is evil.
I would be hurt but I do not value your opinion anyways.
Just call me Pinocchio
Hey MJ,
Just pull my finger and we’ll call it a night
Can you say “Idiotic” statements? Blah Blah Blah. Every other post is yours.
Typical left
I won’t be back often, but I am compelled to respond to this. I like all of you, but I think we all have to figure this out. Here are a few soundbites, just designed to make you think:
1. I voted for Trump but am not a fan.
2. My wife is an immigrant – a very strong-willed and courageous woman.
3. I am not on board 100% with what Trump is doing (maybe 65%) and I think he could do it better.
4. I have one son who wants to impeach Trump.
5. I have another who thinks it is fine.
6. My daughter is in the middle, like me.
7. My wife is 100% behind Trump and she is the immigrant.
8. I despise when the race card or hatred card is played. It’s usually BS and is a putdown on the people it’s used against. I know there are racists and haters but labeling people who disagree with you as that is just wrong.
9. I was at a board meeting yesterday where I was the only Non-Democrat. Of course, they were bashing Trump and calling him a racist. None were immigrants but they were quick to play the race card, so I asked if any had every really reached out to any immigrants and helped them. They were just united in the cause, but had never done a damn thing themselves. So, I’m the racist who has kept a Mexican kid for almost 3 years, a Jamaican couple for 7 months, a Korean girl for 17 months, several African Americans, many Filipinos and some Chinese… all in our home. And I am the racist!
10. Neither side is right here (in my opinion), but all I ask is “what have you done to make the world a better place for minorities?” Expressing outrage on a baseball blog doesn’t even come close. Opening your wallet and your home is a start.
Peace!
Good points Mark.
5 of the 7 people I created an opportunity for and put into business last year are minorities.
Does that count?
Of course!
Good job yesterday, that is the way a blog should function. I take no credit because I did not participate. Hate politics, don’t see how anyone could find anything admirable about either side to defend. Maybe if another Abe Lincoln comes along… I wonder if Boxout is in public relations? The way he attached himself to winners, both FAZ and Trump, leads me to think maybe he is. He plays Chauvin to their Bonaparte. It’s OK, if everybody takes whichever side they believe in, and talk together, things will work out. We may not like how they worked out, but then, we never had any say in the matter anyway, did we? I know Badger will be disappointed he wasn’t here for Mark’s visit. Maybe next time…
Jonah
I wondered about that.
The Fix-Nothing Farce Of Symbolic Politics
Something for everyone here. And a warning to all of us.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-01-31/fix-nothing-farce-symbolic-politics
Is this a Russian website BoxOut7 or does the .ru make it Rumanian? Do you speak the language?
http://live-dota.ru/people/boxout7/